Behemoth & Leviathan

[tribar]

Well sort of a dumb move on CW's part. It looks a lot like Behemoth. Maybe KI and Carowinds will follow suit . Well i think this Leviathan will put CW on the map and will be good for the park

[XYZ]

Robb. Any plans to rate coasters on this site or only parks. Would be interested to see this community's top 10

 

That is an awesome idea

[Schotcher]

I-305! No need to already gave you number one coaster

[gforce532]

Well i think this Leviathan will put CW on the map

 

What do you mean put it on the map? Canada's Wonderland is already the most attended seasonal operating amusement park in North America. Acording to the 2010 Global Attraction Attendance report it gets around 300,000 more either Cedar Point or Kings Island can get (even though its open less days a year). Of course a big part of that is being the only major Amusement park in the Toronto area.

[arson]

Cypress Gardens had a Jr. Suspended coaster and a large Roller Skater - basically the same manufacturer and layout, just one was inverted (and it looks like they're sticking around for Legoland...) Wild Adventures has this, too, but the Roller Skater is the smaller variant.

 

Gemini and Magnum, although they were a decade apart. Same basic concept for both (sitdown airtime machines), same manufacturer (Arrow), and right next to each other to boot. And then there's Glissade and Der Wildkatze, two Schwarzkopf's that opened at Busch Gardens a year apart.

 

Also, Disneyland Paris has a looping, Vekoma Space Mountian, while the Studios park next door has a looping, Vekoma Rock'n'Rollercoaster. Again, decade apart, but still... Same with Universal Orlando, with Flight of the Hippogriff/Woody Woodpecker's Nuthouse Coaster.

[Xcoaster]

Forget the Batman vs SLC at La Ronde, it's all about Monstre track 1 in 1985, followed by Monstre track 2 in 1986. They're practically the same ride, and only a year apart!

 

Seriously, Timber Terror and Tremors at Silverwood (someone beat me to it).  3 years apart, both CCI woodies, very similar designs, one an out-and-back (with buzz bars, if I recall), the other somewhat larger, with great tunnels and a few more turns thrown into the mix. I guess most wood coasters had this issue back in the day, as hypers are really just the contemporary take on the wooden coaster formula (with Behemoth being the out-and-back style, and Leviathan more of a twister). As for hypers, the rides do fit the Magnum and MF pattern nicely, except CP had a lot more time in between, and with different ride companies.

 

My theory about Leviathan is that it was B&Ms proposed giga design for KBF (it almost seems like it could fit along the edge of the park) but they sent it to CW and Knott's wisely chose to go with Intamin's design bid instead. Here's hoping anyways - I want my Intamin giga.

[arson]

My theory about Leviathan is that it was B&Ms proposed giga design for KBF (it almost seems like it could fit along the edge of the park) but they sent it to CW and Knott's wisely chose to go with Intamin's design bid instead. Here's hoping anyways - I want my Intamin giga.

 

Let's hope. Cedar Fair is kind-of running out of parks to build Hyper/Gigacoasters in where they would make an impact.

[coasterlover420]

I think a B&M hyper would make a huge difference at Cedar Point. Granted there is Magnum and Millennium, but the B&M coasters are completely different experiences.

[crazywolf88]

After looking at the story of Behemoth and Leviathan I think it was a smart and innovative move for the park to install two similar coasters to kinda keep true to the story. I mean they were both designed from the same cloth so to speak in the bible and both were mighty beast. It was just one ruled the land and the other ruled the sea. Now what would be cool if they made a B&M flyer themed to the third monster "Ziz"! No wait better yet a wing rider due to the "large wing span" of the monster!

 

Jarvis "I totally get where CW went with this" Morant

I find it funny that behemoth is located on the water and leviathan is located the farthest from water in the park.

[dougr]

I see a couple of posters beat me to it with Silverwood with its twin woodies, so I posit DISNEYLAND:

Matterhorn and

Space Mountain.

[Six Flags Enthuseast]

I have to disagree with people on Silverwood's woodies. Sure, they were made by the same companies within a very short period of time, but I've ridden both and they're very different. TT is almost like a classic woodie with a lot of airtime and an Out-And-Back layout, while Tremors is really its own thing (you need to ride it for yourself, I can't think of something I've ridden to compare it to other than a smoother, shorter, 1-trained Ghostrider). They both are great woodies with some different appeal depending on your taste in woodies.

[Hilltopper39]

Anyone think leviathan was maybe originally intended for Worlds of Fun? Leviathan and Mamba would have had bigger difference in ride experience that Behemoth and Leviathan, and would have been built much farther apart?

 

I can't think of any rides built that close together at any park that are this similar, it really is strange.

 

Goliath at Fiesta Texas and Great White at Sea World San Antonio come to mind as somewhat of an example, not the same park but the exact same ride at 2 different parks in the same city seemed really strange to when SFFT made that announcement. I realize Goliath was relocated and not a new installation but it was equally as baffling.

[montezooma]

Here is another thought on this interesting addition to CW. Even if the Giga coaster was meant for another park, say Knott’s for example, and it was moved to another park (CW) why did it have to remain a Giga Coaster? I mean it is pretty obvious that this ride was custom designed for CW. It is not like they said, “Uh Oh we can’t build it at Knott’s, let’s move it to CW”.

 

Cedar Fair had a giant coaster contracted with B&M for 2012 but that contract just secures them a spot in the B&M schedule I wouldn’t think it secured them a certain typed of coaster. Why didn’t CW just turn the track upside down and build a super Inverted coaster since the one they have sucks? $28,000,000 could have built one hell of an Inverted.

 

Just my thoughts

[jzoole]

^ If this was the case, then probably the reason why is because Cedar Fair didn't just have a contract to get a large B&M. They would have already paid to have plans drawn up for a custom ride, which takes months. They would have already had the plans made, and if this was indeed a last minute move, they wouldn't have time to change them and have new ones created. Make sense? It's the same reason that SFMM cloned Medusa to build Scream instead of a new custom design. It was cheaper and faster to reuse blueprints that had already been designed.

 

However, I'm from the school of thought that the plans were intended for CW all along.

[montezooma]

This ride was obviously designed for Canada’s Wonderland. It would have had a completely differently layout if it was intended to go to Knott’s which is the only logical park in the Cedar Fair family that a Giga Coaster would make financial sense.

 

So let’s role play the situation:

 

Cedar Fair to B&M: “we need a BIG coaster for Knott’s in 2012, can you build us a Giga Coaster?”

B&M to Cedar Fair: “Yes, we will get it on our books but we will need a budget and a small deposit to secure you a spot on our roster”

Cedar Fair to B&M: “Done and done”

 

some time later…

 

City of Buena Park, State of CA and other red tape bullshit to Knott’s: “You will need to jump through some more hoops, pay more taxes and over engineer this sucker before we will permit it”

Cedar Fair: “Uh-Oh, now what are we going to do?”…I know let’s move it to the one of our other major parks that will show a big enough return to justify the expense”

 

Here is where the confusion comes in for me..

 

Cedar Fair to CW: “You guys are going to get Knott’s coaster”

CW: “Sweet! so Knott’s was getting a Giga Coaster right? So rather than come up with something interesting that we don’t already have…let’s just take that idea and make it fit to our park.”

B&M to CW: “Ok well, we can restart the whole design since what we had originally designed for Knott’s won’t really work for you. So you have $28 million to spend…what would you like?”

CW to B&M: “We’ll take what Knott’s had…make it fit and paint it Red”

B&M to CW: “We used all the red paint last year”

CW to B&M: “OK Make it Blue”

 

just my thoughts

Edited August 23, 2011 by montezooma

[montezooma]

from what knowledge I have of how these things happen, I then imagine the conversations went something like this…

 

Someone with some creative thinking says to CW: “let’s take that money and do something really creative and unusual…we could theme it, integrate it into the park so it interacts with the guests and make it unique to our park!”

Marketing then steps in and says: “Well, Behemoth was a HUGE success…rather than reinvent the wheel let’s do the exact same thing only bigger, longer and faster…take all the money and put it towards making it bigger and better and just set it in the parking lot if you have to.

 

Meanwhile back at Knott’s…”Well we lost our coaster what shall we do instead? Should we continue to repaint the entire park hideous colors and lose what uniqueness we had in order to become the Cedar Point of the west coast on 20 acres????””

 

Just my thoughts

[SharkTums]

^I love you Shane!

[montezooma]

Jamaica TPR Cruise Baby! I can’t wait.

[Kumbarider1993]

Six Flags St. Louis' two "River King Mine Train" coasters.

[Calicoasters]

Behemoth, Leviathan... Flashback, Déjà Vu...

 

I remember my first time playing RCT!

[Ejectorbater]

If I were any of these parks and had the option of building a Leviathan or a el cheapo like Green Lantern (Magic Mountain) it would be a no brainer. You could build small, low capacity coaster to up your coaster count or you can build quality attractions like they seem to be doing here at CW. If money is an issue, then hold off on a new coaster for a few years like CP has been doing. This is the reason CP won't whore themselves out like SFMM to get a stupid record. The general public will just see Leviathan as a new coaster, not another B&M like enthusiast would recognize.

[805Andrew]

^I don't think Green Lantern at SFMM is el cheapo, it is built by Intamin and is first of its kind in North America. SFMM reinvented Superman, added a coaster both kids and adults can ride, and gave us a totally new ride experience all in one year so I'm not complaining.

 

Now back to the subject, while their not coasters, remember when Disneyland used to have two different Autopias? Fantasyland Autopia and Tomorrowland Autopia were separate Autopias before they were merged to form one longer Autopia. Two other very similar rides at Disneyland are Dumbo the Flying Elephant and Astro Orbitor. While they are themed differently and are in different lands, they are essentially the same exact ride experience. Back before Disneyland redid Tomorrowland in the mid 90s, they had Rocket Jets instead of Astro Orbitor which was the same type of ride but placed much higher in the sky which gave a much different (and more thrilling) ride experience. Rocket Jets actually made you feel like you were in the air, but Astro Orbitor being on the lowest elevation of Tomorrowland, not so much.

[JJ728]

This is the reason CP won't whore themselves out like SFMM to get a stupid record.

[PSiRockin]

Has anyone mentioned Demon and Shockwave at SFGAm?

[XaviElGrande]

Why is everyone not liking leviathan it looks intense and cedar point has a hyper a giga and the giga is the best steel in the world but I guess the hyper is also a Morgan