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Holiday World (HW) Discussion Thread


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FWIW, I've never visited HW or ridden The Voyage later than May/June, so there may be something to that disparity theory out there, regarding how rough it rides later in the season...

 

As for the second half... It's bat-shizz-crazy, I'll give you that! Like I mentioned earlier... I ride it holding on with one hand, and the other up in the air, like riding a bull - and that's pretty much what it's like! But I just love that out of control, yet I know I'm perfectly safe feeling, and even the amazing Lightning Rod, couldn't quite knock it off its pedestal as my favorite Wooden Coaster! And again, at night...

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I'm going to have to reevaluate Voyage if I ever make a trip back out there. I rode it several times in 2013 and couldn't really decide how I felt about it. I loved the first half, but the second half ended up being too much for me. It is the only roller coaster that literally (yes, literally - I know how to use that word properly) knocked the wind out of me. It's too long for me; I kept wishing it would just end by the end of each lap. Raven is the perfect amount of intense for me because while it does throw you around, it has the decency of having a relatively normal track length. Maybe I'll feel differently the next time I visit, but we'll see.

I understand what you're saying. Voyage is super intense, and I feel like the MCBR is basically the only chance to breathe during the whole run. It's almost too much coaster for me, and that's why I rate it so high, but it definitely could be uncomfortable for some people.

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Like others have mentioned, I loved the first half & twister sections. However, the return leg was a bit rattly if I wasn't in the very front. It's definitely a very unique coaster. Unfortunately I miss out on a night ride since the park closes at 7 today.

 

Legend had insane laterals and more air than expected. Raven was a letdown in the air department (nothing after that big drop halfway through) but had much stronger laterals than expected.

 

Thunderbird's graceful ride is a nice compliment to the 3 woodies and probably the worst major coaster there in my opinion. That launch had a lot more power than I expected though.

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Thunderbird's graceful ride is a nice compliment to the 3 woodies and probably the worst major coaster there in my opinion. That launch had a lot more power than I expected though.

 

This is by no means a knock on Thunderbird, but I too am a little less "high" on that coaster than most people seem to be. Don't get me wrong, I think it's great, and it's my second favorite coaster there, actually! But I still prefer GateKeeper to it as far as Wing Coasters go, and besides the awesome launch, didn't find the rest of it to bring anything appreciably better to the table than GK. It IS a great complement to the three woodies though, and I look forward to hopefully seeing more steel coasters at HW in the future!

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Finally got the 4th American wing coaster, and Thunderbird is still the best in my book. Near misses are what this coaster style is all about, and that's where Gatekeeper can't keep up. It's fun, certainly, but other than the station keyhole, it just doesn't do anything. Here's my ranking:

 

1. Thunderbird

2. Wild Eagle

3. X-Flight

4. Gatekeeper

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^Eh... I think the coaster style is about more than just near misses, and even when it comes to those, GateKeeper's are the most impressive, in my opinion. Having been on all four N.A. coasters myself, I rank them as follows...

 

1. GateKeeper

2. Thunderbird

3. X-Flight

4. Wild Eagle

 

Talk about "not doing anything"... I think Wild Eagle was fun, and its location and view fantastic! But it doesn't really "do anything" much, and certainly does FAR less than the very multi-faceted GK. I know GK is a coaster enthusiasts just seem to love to dog on, but I'll never understand it... I love it every single ride on it, and find it to be incredibly fun - which is what I'm looking for from a coaster! FWIW, I literally have GK and Thunderbird right next to each other in my overall rankings, so they are essentially co-favorites, really.

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Fair enough, people have different tastes. FWIW, I don't really dog on Gatekeeper. Cedar Point has only one bad coaster, and that's Corkscrew. I enjoyed Gatekeeper quite a lot, it's just that I like the others more. If I were in an alternate dimension with all four of them surrounding me, that's my order of preference.

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Interesting that Raven was one of the rougher coasters as that was the smoothest one that I rode out of the three. I figured that it might have been due to the fact that I waited for the front seat though.

This was my experience as well when I visited last August. Raven was, by far, the smoothest (and best) of the three for me. I personally didn't find Voyage to be that intense, but it was brutally violent when I rode it. I got five or six rides in (glutton for punishment, I guess) and it was really the same no matter where I sat on the train. The first half, when it was moving in a relatively straight line, was fine. The turnaround and return leg were terrible though — nonstop pain.

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I don't know if this has ever been discussed, but would HW ever explore RMC'ing one of their woodies there? I'm sorry if this has been discussed, but I don't come in this thread often

 

I ask because it would/could be a way to get some inversions/"steel" in there without building a whole new ride and investment.

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Fair enough, people have different tastes. FWIW, I don't really dog on Gatekeeper. Cedar Point has only one coaster that I think is bad, and that's Corkscrew.

 

FTFY. I hear ya though, it can be a little bangy. Personally, I love Corkscrew. Only a couple rides at a time though!

 

I love Gatekeeper, and I'll take it any day over X-Flight. I'd probably like my home wing coaster but those vests that continue to lock tighter and tighter resulting in a hard to breath situation at the end of the ride really make me avoid it. I wish Great America would fix that.

 

Thunderbird blows them both out of the water! Comfort!? yes. Terrain? yes. Trees!? yes. Next to and around Voyage!? heck yeah!

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I've had a fantasy of HW RMCing Voyage with topper track, but staying mostly true to the original layout (maybe 90% the same). My Voyage rides in 2006/2007 were amongst my all time favorite of any coaster my entire life. They were heaven. If RMC could smooth Voyage out and give their maintenance crew a big time break at the same time, that would be phenomenal.

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^I think my roughest rides on Voyage were in 2011. My best rides were in 2013, and oddly... my experiences have only improved since then! They seem to tweak sections here and there, and are continually replacing track. No matter what they do, the design of Voyage still packs in the power times 2 of about 5 regular wooden coasters. It will always be an aggressive, challenging ride. Love it!

 

If you go with topper track, we don't know how that would last either. Has topper track been used on a steel-structured wood coaster yet? I wonder how that would work out... as it's more steel and more rigidness. That could result in more vibration. I discussed that with one of the Gravity Group guys a few years ago, and he didn't have a quick answer for it, but seemed intrigued by the idea.

 

Didn't HW test out some topper on Voyage at one point? Perhaps around 2012? Someone knows the answer to that. From what I can recall, they decided to skip the topper track in favor of a traditional re-tracking out of wood.

 

As far as RMC goes, I would be very sad to see their trains on any wood-tracked coaster, especially those at HW. People really dog PTC trains, but that old box design in the best for most woodies. Plus, could you imaging being pinned to a plastic bucket seat and not able to move your legs on a full-wooden-tracked coaster? Seems like it might take away from the experience.

Edited by JT325
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^I think my roughest rides on Voyage were in 2011. My best rides were in 2013, and oddly... my experiences have only improved since then! They seem to tweak sections here and there, and are continually replacing track. No matter what they do, the design of Voyage still packs in the power times 2 of about 5 regular wooden coasters. It will always be an aggressive, challenging ride. Love it!

 

If you go with topper track, we don't know how that would last either. Has topper track been used on a steel-structured wood coaster yet? I wonder how that would work out... as it's more steel and more rigidness. That could result in more vibration. .

Twisted Twins ----> Storm Chaser iron horse was wood with steel structure, now all steel I believe. If they can do that, they should be able to do topper track.

 

We forgot/didn't realize the park was over an hour back in time zone difference, so we're here over an hour early and taking a Subway break.

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Twisted Twins ----> Storm Chaser iron horse was wood with steel structure, now all steel I believe. If they can do that, they should be able to do topper track.

 

It would seem it might be ok, but it brings up a couple questions. RMC uses hinges at the ledger - track connection, with metal connecting plates on both their steel and hybrid-wood (topper track) coasters. I think they also used that construction when they added topper track to part of the GA Cyclone. I guess I'm just getting it clear in my head... if they changed over to topper track on a wood track coaster, it would have to be topper-track/RMC from the ledger up. It's not as simple as throwing the topper track on where the top 2 wood layers once were.

 

Oh heck, I love Voyage the way it is Fun to discuss, but I like it with classic wood track.

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Yeah, as much as I love all the RMC coasters I've been on, I don't want them to touch The Voyage, honestly! I would have been fine with them having at The Legend, but now that CCI had at it instead, I doubt that's going to happen either.

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Honestly, Voyage in its original brand-new state is what I really want, and I don't ever want it to age. Impossible, I know! God I have such amazing memories of that ride when it was in its first couple seasons. Haven't been to HW since 2010, but I feel like I wouldn't mind the roughness that some people seem to over exaggerate.

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I've been picturing a full Ghostrider-style GCI refurb. All new track, millennium flyers, but still traditional laminate construction. Not sure how likely that is, though. I'm pretty ok with the way it rides now. Those PTCs though can beat me up depending on where I sit. Front seat is my favorite spot on Voyage right now.

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I think the Raven is perfectly ridable as is but if GCI were to come in I'd think the finale and turnaround by the lake are the spots that need it most.

 

I would have loved to see those Timberliners on Voyage but remember them stopping the tests. What was the reason again they were never used?

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^^ Please keep GCI as far away from The Voyage as possible. For me, it's either RMC or nothing.

^ The park never gave a reason to why they decided to not use them.

 

This is just my opinion, but I think there are a couple of reasons why.

1. The Gravity Group took too long in delivering the promised product. The park allowed The Gravity Group to test their product on the park's ride at the park's expense for about four years and the park got nothing out of it except a train that didn't deliver (they still have that train btw) and a whole bunch of extra track maintenance.

 

2. Those trains wouldn't have delivered a better ride experience unless the park did a complete retrack. The main reasons they decided to purchase the trains was to deliver a smoother ride and reduce track maintenance. Anyone who rode Hades 360 in it's first year will tell you that ride didn't become smoother. I can't speak for the reduced track maintenance. Ultimately, I think the park decided that they could deliver the best ride experience by continuing to maintain the ride the way they have been, while making a couple modifications (taking the 7th car off the train and using the MCBR as a trim) to reduce the maintenance and make the ride more enjoyable for their guests.

 

I really don't think the park wants to add another wooden coaster at the moment, but I would like to see them build one of those smaller Gravity Group wooden coasters (ex. Wooden Warrior) and use the train they have so they can get a roller coaster that has a 42" requirement, which is something they really lack being a family park.

Edited by ZeroGravity55
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I think the Raven is perfectly ridable as is but if GCI were to come in I'd think the finale and turnaround by the lake are the spots that need it most.

 

I would have loved to see those Timberliners on Voyage but remember them stopping the tests. What was the reason again they were never used?

 

Lots of reasons: cost as it required a complete re-tracking, prototyping never worked out with that train, losing Will Koch and the whole turmoil that fell over the ownership of Holiday World which led them to drop the purchase of Kentucky Kingdom and Will's daughters booting out half of the Koch family from the park. Essentially a lot of really bad stuff was happening and unfortunately the Timberliner conversion fell into the middle of it.

 

I think we'll eventually see something happen to Voyage to improve its comfort, but it'll probably be a while thanks to its giant expensive steel counterpart known as Thunderbird.

Edited by Lareson
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^^ Please keep GCI has far away from The Voyage as possible. For me, it's either RMC or nothing.

Voyage absolutely does not need the millennium flyer trains. They do not guarantee an improvement to a wooden roller coaster. Take it from Gwazi.

 

If you mean RMC coming in to retrack the coaster, then I'm totally fine with it too. But if you mean A complete topper track overhaul, then I'm not so on board with that. The ride experience will likely change drastically and require a huge amount of reprofiling to accommodate the new trains. You'd be looking at an entirely new roller coaster by then.

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