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Busch Gardens Williamsburg (BGW BGE) Discussion Thread

P. 457: Pantheon Roller Coaster POV!

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I don't know what is funnier - someone saying Grizzly is a good coaster or GCI's have ejector airtime.

 

I guess I was also hoping for this to be the big RMC with how much teasing they did...I agree that GCI's are fun but nothing crazy destination worthy. The ride looks pretty short too.

 

I just feel like Verbolten, Tempesto, and this have made for weird additions for a large park in the 21st century! All are good rides but I guess I expected something more from Busch.

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I don't know what is funnier - someone saying Grizzly is a good coaster or GCI's have ejector airtime.

 

I guess I was also hoping for this to be the big RMC with how much teasing they did...I agree that GCI's are fun but nothing crazy destination worthy. The ride looks pretty short too.

 

I just feel like Verbolten, Tempesto, and this have made for weird additions for a large park in the 21st century! All are good rides but I guess I expected something more from Busch.

I think BGW spending so much $$$ on Verbolten is why Tempesto and this family GCI are being installed. Both well under $10 million
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The best examples of ejector airtime I've experienced are on El Toro and Maverick.

Skyrush tho

I need to get to Hershey. That's all on me lol.

 

I wasn't going to say anything but thank God someone said Grizzly is crap. You spend more time squealing through the first turnaround destroying any remnants left of your eardrum left from just hearing the ride from the station than you do on the rest of the ride. How was that ride supposed to replicate Beast? I haven't ridden it at night but I imagine all that would do is prevent me from leaning into the turns.

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^Grizzly is an awesome ride. Sustained laterals, big pop of air heading into a tunnel, wooded setting. Fantastic ride.

 

I'm a little surprised at the overall negativity here. Not from everybody, just from a decent number of people. People are always constantly begging parks like Dorney to put in a GCI, now here a park is actually doing it and people are being all down on GCI. As a wooden coaster fan (significantly more so than steel) I'm totally psyched for this. I've never been on an "upper tier" GCI like Thunderhead, in fact I've only ever been on the two at Hershey. As woodies go, they don't have much to them, but it looks like GCI have improved their designs a LOT since then. They may not be the most intense but they have a broad appeal, less intimidating than what RMC does. Seems like a great fit for the park.

 

 

Of course I do wish it was about 30 feet higher and 1000 feet longer. I'm not sure why they went that small, it's not like making it shorter really makes it any more or less family friendly.

Edited by neil009
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Even BGT has Scorpion & Sand Serpent for 42" kids and they will be adding another 42" ride Cobra's Curse this year. If this new woodie ends up being 42" then I would agree it's a perfect fit for the park, but at 46" or 48" sorry but that's dumb.

 

If you're going to build a 48" woodie in 2016 and you actually want to get people excited when their other choices are rides like Loch Ness Monster & Verbolten, a 45MPH cute family woodie isn't going to do it. You put a 42" height restriction on that ride, and it suddenly becomes the best thing that's ever happened to kids ages 4-8 years old. And the parents will appreciate it too because they aren't stuck in the "kiddie area" and have their child's "first big coaster" they can ride with them. Brothers or sisters will have a cool fun ride they can take their younger, shorter sibling on, etc.

 

That's the only way this ride makes sense to me, IMO.

 

Think about this for a moment. You know I'm right.

I'm just quoting this for truth here. I'm a father of a 4-year-old boy who absolutely loves his coasters, but is currently measuring up at 44", so he's a bit restricted in what he's able to ride at any given park. As it stands, with their current lineup of rides, I wouldn't be taking my family to BGW until he puts on a few more inches. If this woodie ends up having a 42" restriction? I might end up rethinking our 2017 travel plans.

 

This is why I love parks like Knoebels and Hersheypark, where they have a great mix of both intense stuff for grown ups as well as ones that even the brave little kids can enjoy. More parks would do well to keep as much in mind.

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I'm just quoting this for truth here. I'm a father of a 4-year-old boy who absolutely loves his coasters, but is currently measuring up at 44", so he's a bit restricted in what he's able to ride at any given park. As it stands, with their current lineup of rides, I wouldn't be taking my family to BGW until he puts on a few more inches. If this woodie ends up having a 42" restriction? I might end up rethinking our 2017 travel plans.

 

This is why I love parks like Knoebels and Hersheypark, where they have a great mix of both intense stuff for grown ups as well as ones that even the brave little kids can enjoy. More parks would do well to keep as much in mind.

 

I totally agree with this, my youngest is current about 45", so she is really limited on what coasters she can ride. She still enjoys kiddie rides but wants to ride something bigger with her siblings. We went to Hershey for 3 days last summer and one of the deciding factors in going there was that they have 4 "big" coasters with a 42" height requirement--Laff Track, Comet, SDL, and Trailblazer. We have put off taking the kids to BGW until she is older bc she can't ride anything right now. BGW is one of my favorite parks and a 42" woodie would be a HUGE hit with families and give them something they currently don't have.

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I'm not expecting a very thrilling ride out of this one, but something light and fun to do inbetween the bigger and better rides, something like backlot stunt coaster or a good mine train.

 

Of course a tiny terrain woodie that turned out to be a monster of a ride would be a welcome surprise.

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Sorry I mispoke its between 46 inch (White Lightening) and 48 inches. Still allows for kids to ride.

Actually, I just noticed something, that update on the TPR park index was after Verbolten was opened. I forgot that ride is also 48" which replaced the 42" Big Bad Wolf. So if this new GCI woodie also ends up being 48 or even 46" then they still have not filled that gap that Big Bad Wolf left when it closed.

 

And sorry, but your comment comes off as little ignorant to how parks should balance their attractions. Sure, "kids" can ride, but slightly older kids. If it ends up being 48" that means there is still no coaster for kids to ride between 38" and 48" and IMO that's a horrible balance for the park.

 

Even BGT has Scorpion & Sand Serpent for 42" kids and they will be adding another 42" ride Cobra's Curse this year. If this new woodie ends up being 42" then I would agree it's a perfect fit for the park, but at 46" or 48" sorry but that's dumb.

 

If you're going to build a 48" woodie in 2016 and you actually want to get people excited when their other choices are rides like Loch Ness Monster & Verbolten, a 45MPH cute family woodie isn't going to do it. You put a 42" height restriction on that ride, and it suddenly becomes the best thing that's ever happened to kids ages 4-8 years old. And the parents will appreciate it too because they aren't stuck in the "kiddie area" and have their child's "first big coaster" they can ride with them. Brothers or sisters will have a cool fun ride they can take their younger, shorter sibling on, etc.

 

That's the only way this ride makes sense to me, IMO.

 

Think about this for a moment. You know I'm right.

 

You are. I remember my first visit to Busch Gardens (1995). I was excited to ride the roller coasters, but was too short at the time for almost everything except for BBW. I remember my family thinking I'd be tall enough for LNM, but I just missed out (I was tall enough the following year). Forget about DF (both times I went to BGW in the 90's when DF was still running, I was too short).

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I'm a little surprised at the overall negativity here. Not from everybody, just from a decent number of people. People are always constantly begging parks like Dorney to put in a GCI, now here a park is actually doing it and people are being all down on GCI.

Trust me, the people who are being down on this ride have not been begging for Dorney to put in a GCI. And there's a big difference between being "negative" and being "disappointed." Like I said, I'm sure the ride will do very well by the park and will be liked by many, many people, normal guests and enthusiasts alike, but this type of ride isn't my favorite. I actually don't dislike any GCI woodie, they just don't blow me away. But I have fun on every single one of them...

 

I've never been on an "upper tier" GCI like Thunderhead, in fact I've only ever been on the two at Hershey. As woodies go, they don't have much to them, but it looks like GCI have improved their designs a LOT since then.

Looking at the list of GCI woodies, turns out I've been on every single one of them. To be honest, they all ride about the same to varying degrees. Some better than others, but really, they are all VERY similar in many ways. I will say this, though, some of my favorite rides from them (El Toro, White Lightning, etc) have been some of their smaller rides.

 

Of course I do wish it was about 30 feet higher and 1000 feet longer. I'm not sure why they went that small, it's not like making it shorter really makes it any more or less family friendly.

The length is the stat that really gets me. They have proven with rides like El Toro that it doesn't need to be tall to be good, but White Lightning IS short and I always felt that was more because of the limited space they had, and also, it's a ride that you can easily re-ride over and over, so that ride being short isn't that big of a deal. But if I had to wait in line an hour for White Lightning or El Toro, honestly, I'd like it a lot less.

Edited by robbalvey
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I'm a little surprised at the overall negativity here. Not from everybody, just from a decent number of people. People are always constantly begging parks like Dorney to put in a GCI, now here a park is actually doing it and people are being all down on GCI.

Trust me, the people who are being down on this ride have not been begging for Dorney to put in a GCI. And there's a big difference between being "negative" and being "disappointed." Like I said, I'm sure the ride will do very well by the park and will be liked by many, many people, normal guests and enthusiasts alike, but this type of ride isn't my favorite. I actually don't dislike any GCI woodie, they just don't blow me away. But I have fun on every single one of them...

 

Right, fun is all I'm expecting here, not expecting to be blown away. Sure I'd rather a Gravity Group ride but they don't seem to be doing so well state-side, so it's hard for me to be too disappointed by that. I feel like this will compliment BGW's line-up a little better than an RMC since you'll get more of that "rough and tumble" wood feel to contrast with all that steel. IMO this is the perfect addition for them... with the exception of the size.

 

I've never been on an "upper tier" GCI like Thunderhead, in fact I've only ever been on the two at Hershey. As woodies go, they don't have much to them, but it looks like GCI have improved their designs a LOT since then.

Looking at the list of GCI woodies, turns out I've been on every single one of them. To be honest, they all ride about the same to varying degrees. Some better than others, but really, they are all VERY similar in many ways. I will say this, though, some of my favorite rides from them (El Toro, White Lightning, etc) have been some of their smaller rides.

 

I won't know until I ride it of course but of the ones I've closely examined through youtube, Thunderhead, Gold Striker, and Ozark Wildcat, they appear to have quicker pacing and way more airtime. I may be shooting the case I just made a little bit but the two GCIs at Hershey have basically no airtime. Like none at all. So any would be an improvement.

 

Of course I do wish it was about 30 feet higher and 1000 feet longer. I'm not sure why they went that small, it's not like making it shorter really makes it any more or less family friendly.

The length is the stat that really gets me. They have proven with rides like El Toro that it doesn't need to be tall to be good, but White Lightning IS short and I always felt that was more because of the limited space they had, and also, it's a ride that you can easily re-ride over and over, so that ride being short isn't that big of a deal. But if I had to wait in line an hour for White Lightning or El Toro, honestly, I'd like it a lot less.

 

Yeah I don't know if I've ever been on a ride that short that didn't FEEL "too short". Too short is no deal breaker of course, but longer is always better. Also the fact that they're trying to sell it as an extreme thrill ride, like 45 mph is really a big deal, is also really weird. I would think it would be smarter to sell it more from its classic nostalgia appeal, like how Knoebels markets their rides. Attaching the darker Viking theme to it might be a bit much for a little GCI.

Edited by neil009
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IMO this is the perfect addition for them... with the exception of the size.

And height requirement. The more I think about it, the more I do hope this ends up being a 42" ride otherwise it really won't make sense at all.

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^I don't have kids so I can't comment there. I can see what you mean about not making any sense from a business standpoint. In my own private little world (filled with nothing but woodies and Arrow hypers) it makes perfect sense.

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Doesn't announce a triple launching steel coaster with inversions, but goes overboard with the teasers for something that is no more than a family coaster and announces it a year in advance? Okay...

 

Don't get me wrong, I understand the marketing department might be taking their cues from upper management, but who ever is making these decisions needs to be shown the door.

 

If this ride doesn't have a 42 inch height requirement, maybe the whole management team needs to be shown the door. As Robb has said, this addition won't make any sense if it doesn't have a 42 inch height requirement.

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Just being a nerd, I am really underwhelmed by BGW's last two coasters, and I don't have many positives to say other than vikings are cool and I really hope that something signature in the level of Pompei, darkastle, Griffon, loch ness, etc. is still in this world-class park's DNA. I really hoped for more and I don't think I'm crazy for that.

 

Both are positive additions...but this one better be very family friendly like others are saying because it certainly isn't as thrilling as this park is capable of.

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It looks like from this article, the height requirement will be 46":

 

The height requirement will be 46 inches so adults and children can ride together.

 

“This will be a great ride for families, but make no mistake: this will not be a kiddie ride,” Giles said. “It’s going to be a wild ride.”

 

Source: http://pilotonline.com/entertainment/new-roller-coaster-coming-to-busch-gardens---and/article_7bea759c-b347-5173-9f6f-f2359a8f7da7.html

I don't know. 46" is better than 48", but that's still a taller height than most family coasters. Some may argue that 4" is not a lot, but in growing children, it is. It might take a couple of years for someone to grow from 42 to 46.

 

Maybe it will be a great ride, but right now it's hard to say what it really will be. It's not exactly a family ride, but with those stats, and GCI building it, it isn't really a thrill ride either.

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It looks like from this article, the height requirement will be 46":

 

Some may argue that 4" is not a lot, but in growing children, it is. It might take a couple of years for someone to grow from 42 to 46.

 

I'd say many people would argue that it is a lot considering even up to the big coaster height restrictions that's what can make or break a day out for kids when being denied something. For parks in the UK like Alton Towers 4" at that height is the difference between being allowed a very tiny coaster (in an area of the park themed around a channel known for very young kids programming) and a powered mine train to at least being able to go on the "scary" Thirteen or a spinning coaster. It can really make or break a small younger child's day out.

 

I mean the 46" height restriction gets you on the arrow looper here in Korea and that's only 5 inches less (sorry I'm used to cm and the coasters here and the U.K. tend to go up by 10cm each time) than T Express one of the steepest, ejector air time filled, non RMC wooden coasters out there. So again that 4"-5" jump is a lot.

Edited by Garet
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Yeah, color me disappointed about the 46" restriction. Though, wishful thinking, maybe this is part of a longer-term plan and there will be a bunch of new flat rides with 36-46" restrictions installed over the next few years.

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The smallness could make this work all the better with the terrain, etc., going to have to see how it turns out. It could also result in them having the only modern woodie in the area, although I'd like to see it be one of 3 modern woodies appearing here in 2017, vs. RMC Hurler and Roar .

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^I don't have kids so I can't comment there. I can see what you mean about not making any sense from a business standpoint. In my own private little world (filled with nothing but woodies and Arrow hypers) it makes perfect sense.

You're not the core demographic of the park.

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It looks like from this article, the height requirement will be 46":

That's disappointing. This has always been one of my biggest complaints about GCI woodies. It makes zero sense to me that a 40" kid can ride "Tower of Terror" but a 42" kid can't ride any of GCI's woodies, which don't even come close to the intensity of a woodie like Knoebel's Phoenix or Twister, which are also both 42"

 

IMO, it just shows extremely poor design and a lack of understanding of park guests from GCI and I'm shocked there has never been an attempt to correct that.

Edited by robbalvey
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We went to the park yesterday for preview day and had a great time. I'll spare everyone the trip report but just a few key observations.

 

1) Apollo's Chariot is a really underrated ride in the very back row. It's nothing to write home about otherwise but a great ride in the back. The pre drop makes for a spectacular moment of airtime down the drop and the same can be said for the airtime hills immediately after the midcourse.

 

2) For everyone saying Alpengeist is rough, grow some balls. There's nothing rough about this ride. This is probably still our favorite coaster in the park.

 

3) Kudos to the park for running the water rides despite the ridiculously low temperatures. Pompei is as amazing as ever. Quite a few people were riding it since it barely gets you wet and the effects are insane.

 

4) Tempesto was fun, it was our first ride on it and I enjoyed it immensely.

 

5) Hats off to the staff! All day people went above and beyond to make our day great. We asked one woman working at a gift shop how late the stores were open as we wanted to go ride Alpengeist and then come back and buy something. She said we could buy it then and she would hold it. 10 minutes later when we got back she was standing outside holding the bag. Way above and beyond! We didn't expect that.

 

Also, despite catching the last train of the day on Alpengeist it wasn't our last ride. About 15 minutes after close we noticed the Sky Ride still sending buckets around and they let us catch one to the front of the park. Little things like that are just awesome to see.

 

6) Those Bavarian Pretzels tho

 

Overall we had an awesome day! Hats off to everyone at BGW!

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^Apollo's Chariot is definitely a backseat ride. I don't find Alpengeist all that rough, either.

 

I'll be posting photos of other stuff around the park a bit later today. As for the three possible names for the new ride, none of them thrill me, either (crowd at the announcement seemed underwhelmed by the choices, too).

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