Busch Gardens Williamsburg (BGW BGE) Discussion Thread

[robbalvey]

^If that's the case then they definitely have a winner on their hands. The one thing I really liked about Expedition Everest was that although it is a big ride, it is accessible to the younger crowd and offers some interesting thrill elements that most family rides don't offer.

You didn't read what I said. I think they *DO* have a winner on their hands, but I kind of feel it's going to be lost on quite a large audience with a 48" height restriction. Verbolten has the same height restriction as Loch Ness Monster. A giant multi-looping coaster. Big Bad Wolf had a 42" height restriction, and this ride requires their riders to be six inches taller. That's quite a difference when you talk about kids, and Verbolten doesn't appear to be *that* much more thrilling than Big Bad Wolf (which was actually a pretty thrilling ride in itself!)

 

Again, while I personally haven't been on the ride, it does *look* as though this ride is a *great* family coaster, similar to the likes of Expedition Everest, but I think going with a manufacturer who gave them a 48" height restriction, or not figuring out a way to make it a bit lower, could have been a mistake.

 

Think about it - Tower of Terror is a 40" height restriction. Mindbender is 42". Why is Verbolten 48"???

 

Like I said, Expedition Everest is 44", and that's kind of a perfect "split the difference" between a ride like "Big Thunder Mountain" and "Cheetah Hunt."

 

This ride does NOT look like it's on par with Cheetah Hunt, but it's height restriction is sending the message that it is.

 

--Robb "Always hate to see good family coasters where not all of the family can ride...but they probably should be able to!" Alvey

Edited May 20, 2012 by robbalvey

[jmicha]

^Sorry, my response didn't come off correctly. I agree with you that it looks like they definitely have a winner on their hands but it's definitely true that the height restrictions will deny a large portion of the target audience from riding. Not having kids or siblings that are at that stage in life it isn't really something I think about when at parks, but 48" does seem a little too tall for a ride like this. I wonder if there is any ability for them to go shorter or if this is the absolute minimum suggested by Zierer.

[Jwalther420]

I don't know how these decisions are made really. I'm sure most of it is technical in nature...how is the seat formed vs. the average length of the femur of a 48" tall child which would prevent it from rounding the corner and slipping out of the restraints. I'm sure some of it is political. I suspect for BGW, part of it lies in that they have no coaster with a height restriction under 48". LNM is 48". They already have some confusion with AC being 52" and not the more typical 54" for B&M hypers. Maybe they didn't want yet another tier of height restrictions, even if 46" or 44" tall children could safely ride verbolten. They already have like 7 colors of bands for the various height restrictions in the park. Maybe 8 was too many.

 

Ninja Edit: of course, BBW was 42" so that blows my theory away. For the record, the dark portion does get pretty intense, especially for a 42" individual. My 4 kids having recently gone through that phase, I suspect it would have been too intense for them at that age/height.

 

--Justin

Edited May 20, 2012 by Jwalther420

[robbalvey]

^ But Curse of DarKastle is 42" (along with many flat rides and water riders) so they already have that tier. And Big Bad Wolf was 42", and it's only been gone for two seasons, so it's not like they haven't had a 42" height restriction coaster ever. Wild Maus was also only 42". So that height restriction is kind of a void they've been needing to fill, especially in the roller coaster department.

Edited May 20, 2012 by robbalvey

[Jwalther420]

Good call Robb on the other rides. See my ninja edit above. I doubt my kids would have ridden Verbolten when they were 42" tall. It does get a little hairy inside in the dark.

[robbalvey]

For the record, the dark portion does get pretty intense, especially for a 42" individual. My 4 kids having recently gone through that phase, I suspect it would have been too intense for them at that age/height.

That's why I was saying maybe more along the lines of Everest's 44"? I dunno, I haven't been on the ride so I can't fully comment. But is the dark section more intense than the extreme airtime you get on Tower of Terror, for example? And that's 40"!

[imawesome1124]

About the whole 48" height restriction, it might not be permanent. I've seen rides that have gotten them changed, but they've gone up, not down. Maybe Verbolten's might get lowered to 44" with some modifications to either the ride itself or just the trains.

 

Edit:

But is the dark section more intense than the extreme airtime you get on Tower of Terror, for example? And that's 40"!

People have been saying that the helix is more forceful than they expected it to be, and Busch Gardens claims you get 1.8 seconds of airtime in the building. I'm also not going to judge it until I've ridden it, but based on what people are saying I agree with Robb about the height restriction maybe being to high, but remember that there's a possibility that it could get lowered.

[robbalvey]

^ I hope so! Remember even Millennium Force started out as 52" and it got lowered to 48"

[Schotcher]

I think they were just playing it safe with 48 inches. With DarKastle, they left it at 42 inches but added a warning about the ride sequence, and I'm sure people probably complained about it freaking out their kids and/or not seeing the sign, so BGW took it into their own hands and just upped the height requirement for Verbolten. That's just how I think of it though.

[robbalvey]

^ I actually don't think that's the case at all. I'm 99.9999% positive the height restriction came from the ride manufacturer based on train design, what they felt the forces of the ride may do, etc.

 

I make this educated guess because I spoke with Zierer at IAAPA and they mentioned this. It also was the same height restriction for the Legoland Billund ride, and that coaster seems even tamer.

 

Now that being said, the park can, and sometimes will work with a ride manufacturer to get a lower height restriction during the development phase, or sometimes after a ride has opened to the public.

 

On the flip side, BGW does seem to have odd height restrictions on both sides of the coin. They have a 52" B&M hyper where I believe all the others are 54", and they have a 48" chair swings, which is normally 42" at most parks.

 

So who knows. But I'm pretty sure this is a Zierer thing, and I really hope the ride either REALLY delivers on a 48" height restriction or it an be eventually lowered. Thirteen also has a 48" height restriction and I personally think its totally rediculous. That ride is NOT more intense than either Expedition Everest or Tower of Terror.

Edited May 20, 2012 by robbalvey

[Intimidator305]

I honestly can't believe that Tower of Terror is only 40 inches! Good job to Disney for low height requirements.

[Jwalther420]

My .02 on the Tower of Terror being so low in relation to coaster is that the movement of the ride is more predictable. The motion is in 1 plane and is probably easier to design a restraint that holds in riders in a wide range of sizes. I think its a bad comparison.

[SharkTums]

^They weren't using ToT as a comparison for the restraint, they were using it as an example of having a higher restriction because a ride is 'scary'.

[Jwalther420]

I understand Elissa. My comment was more a remark on why ride heights are set the way they are. You guys definitely know better than me. Do heights get set based on how scary rides are or based on the physical limitations of the restraints vs. the motion of the ride. I'd like to think the latter is true and height restrictions aren't some artificial gauge on a subjective measure of scariness.

[SharkTums]

^It's absolutely both.

 

Alien Encounter/God Awful Stitch is a perfect example. When it was turned into Stitch and Disney thought children would love being locked in a dark room with a restraint over them it opened with a 35'' height restriction...it was then raised to 38", and again to 40". It wasn't a restraint issue, purely a 'show' issue.

[XYZ]

I understand Elissa. My comment was more a remark on why ride heights are set the way they are. You guys definitely know better than me. Do heights get set based on how scary rides are or based on the physical limitations of the restraints vs. the motion of the ride. I'd like to think the latter is true and height restrictions aren't some artificial gauge on a subjective measure of scariness.

 

The height limit is usually because of the restraints, though when a coaster is built, the manufacturer and the park decides what age group is best for the coaster and they make the restraints so that it fits the age group. Some manufacturers like B&M make almost all their coasters have a 54" height requirement because they don't think that anyone shorter than that would want to ride it because of how intense it looks.

 

Verbolten probably has a 48" height limit mostly because of the two launches as Pony Express (KBF) & Manta (SWSD) both are family launched coasters with a 48" height limit.

 

Also, Disney is an exception since they manufacture a lot of the rides themselves, so they make their own safety requirements and Disney Parks are visited by a lot of children, so they have height limits that are usually low.

[cfc]

I like Robb's suggestion of a "split the difference" 44-inch height requirement. The comparison to Everest is appropriate, although I think Everest has a higher "thrill" element that Verbolten. My guess is that the launched sections, which do pack a little kick, and the freefall drop could be driving the 48-inch height requirement.

[CardCraze]

Just got back from the park today, and rode Verbolten for the first time.

 

It was a really good coaster, and I thought the show building was really well done.

 

In terms of as a move for the park, this is great. The rides elements of launches, and dropping track, and the whole show building should serve to be a GP magnet. I can hear it already, "And this one part, the ride breaks down and the car falls and lands on the track underneath!"

 

It was honestly a lot better than I was expecting.

[TXman308]

Question: In the "Spirit scene", was does she say right before you drop?

[robbalvey]

Some manufacturers like B&M make almost all their coasters have a 54" height requirement because they don't think that anyone shorter than that would want to ride it because of how intense it looks.

 

Disney is an exception since they manufacture a lot of the rides themselves, so they make their own safety requirements

Where do you get your information from?!?!?

 

Seriously, you are speaking with such authority, yet so much of this is completely wrong it's embarrassing.

 

Please. If you don't know what you're talking about, I would really appreciate it if you would stop posting to our forums.

 

--Robb "I'm not joking." Alvey

[robbalvey]

Verbolten probably has a 48" height limit mostly because of the two launches as Pony Express (KBF) & Manta (SWSD) both are family launched coasters with a 48" height limit.

If Power Keg can have a 42" height restriction, I'm SURE Verbolten can have a 44" height restriction.

 

I refuse to believe the launches on Verbolten are more powerful than Powder Keg.

 

--Robb

Edited May 20, 2012 by robbalvey

[SoCalCoasters]

^^He gets his info from the Dippin' Dot Guy, how else could he know so much?

 

^^^I think it's something like: "Come this way" or "Come closer".

[cfc]

I refuse to believe the launches on Verbolten are more powerful than Powder Keg.

 

--Robb

 

I agree with this. The launches give a nice kick, but not an "S&S kick."

[Markolodeon]

Funny on the Expedition Everest comparisons - after my first ride my immediate thought was that it's a cross between Expedition Everest and Space Mountain. Definitely fun and unique, I love Verbolten! And based on the smiles and cheers from everyone riding it on Saturday it's clear BGE made a great move. Love that there are three themes/programs to it, I've only caught 2 of the 3 so far.

[cfc]

^For me, the Everest comparison kicked in with the highly themed queue and fast-moving line.