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Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK, KK) Discussion Thread

P. 401: Herschend Enterprises named majority partner and park operator

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Was having a smoke next to Top Gun at PGA recently and noticed the zero-g roll sways an insane amount and pretty much stays in motion until the next train goes through it.

 

Made me face the other way during my cigarette, that's for damn sure.

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It's neither cheap, easy, or practical to dig a 100 foot deep tunnel. Apparently Roller Coaster Tycoon is catching on again.

Herschend was and is a different brand than Six Flags.   There is one certainty. Kentucky Kingdom will not be receiving a launched wooden roller coaster any time soon.

Yeah, I think the only 'concern' is because people see this park going more the way of Celebration City or Wild Adventures than becoming the next SDC or Dollywood.  I think it will stay pretty much th

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There are some definite issues with the queue for Lightning Run. I wouldn't be surprised to see the entire entrance and exit paths reworked to allow the entrance to have switchbacks by the main path and then lead to the station house.

 

Also, something a friend of mine pointed out, the rails for the ride, as well as the wheels of the trains are exposed above the wood decking. I'm not sure how atypical this is, but it definitely looks odd compared to many of the arrow loopers with similar track tie styles, and could be an easy pinch point for ride-ops or those entering and exiting the vehicles. I'm not sure how fixable this is without resurfacing and raising the deck in that area, but still something that was noticed.

 

There are a few infrastructure changes to be made around the park in the coming years, for example, the park needs to do something about how people move when coming off the bridge to the southern side of the park. But, everyday, I drive past the park and am amazed at what they were able to pull off in the time period they had. I never really had a chance to visit the park when it was owned by Ed Hart v1.0, but I look forward to seeing how he makes it all come together in the following years.

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There are some definite issues with the queue for Lightning Run. I wouldn't be surprised to see the entire entrance and exit paths reworked to allow the entrance to have switchbacks by the main path and then lead to the station house.

 

Also, something a friend of mine pointed out, the rails for the ride, as well as the wheels of the trains are exposed above the wood decking. I'm not sure how atypical this is, but it definitely looks odd compared to many of the arrow loopers with similar track tie styles, and could be an easy pinch point for ride-ops or those entering and exiting the vehicles. I'm not sure how fixable this is without resurfacing and raising the deck in that area, but still something that was noticed.

 

There are a few infrastructure changes to be made around the park in the coming years, for example, the park needs to do something about how people move when coming off the bridge to the southern side of the park. But, everyday, I drive past the park and am amazed at what they were able to pull off in the time period they had. I never really had a chance to visit the park when it was owned by Ed Hart v1.0, but I look forward to seeing how he makes it all come together in the following years.

 

Lets hope he doesn't decide to sell it again this time.

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5.) Lightning Run is quite unfriendly to heavier guests. I only saw 1 person turned away today, but from my impression, he wasn't extremely overweight. If you have any concern of not being able to fit, make sure to try the test seat by the entrance before waiting.

 

I'm definitely not the world's biggest guy so I'm not really worried. But how would you compare it to say Outlaw Run?

 

I dont think its too unreasonably unfriendly. When I was there I saw quite a few guest that would likely be considered large riding it. I think that due to the restraint style its likely that body shape will matter more than size. I would say that if one fits onto Outlaw Run, they will likely fit onto Lightning Run.

-Kafka-

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I know it's really early to be judging crowd sizes, but does anyone have a reasonable estimate for Sunday's crowds?

I visited briefly on Memorial Day. The crowds weren't that bad, at least in the front of the park. Waited less than an hour for Lightning Run and that was with it breaking down for about 10-15 minutes. Don't expect to get a season pass processed quickly though.

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22_726.jpg

 

I have been looking at this photo and wondering why the park doesn't have fences up around the low sections of track to have another barrier between people and the track. I may be more aware of this than some due to my home park, Worlds of Fun, having an accident in the 70's where a child got in front of Screamroller and was hit by a train. Now, all the coasters have fences up around the low areas of track. This ride looks like it could use some of them as well.

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I know it's really early to be judging crowd sizes, but does anyone have a reasonable estimate for Sunday's crowds?

 

Going by opening weekend it will be busy but planning should make it tolerable. I would absolutely run to Thunder Run and ride it first; then double back and hit Fear Fall. The wait last Sunday for Thunder Run was an hour around 5-7pm, even with very very quick dispatch times. Lightning Run's wait was only around 30 min when the line was stretching out past to BBQ resturant. It was not too bad at all; I can't vouch for the other rides wait times. If you are trying to do Deep Water Dive prepare to wait, it'll probably busy.

 

I have been looking at this photo and wondering why the park doesn't have fences up around the low sections of track to have another barrier between people and the track. I may be more aware of this than some due to my home park, Worlds of Fun, having an accident in the 70's where a child got in front of Screamroller and was hit by a train. Now, all the coasters have fences up around the low areas of track. This ride looks like it could use some of them as well.

 

I'm waiting to see how long it takes before the Darwin Fences do get installed. I noticed that the first time we entered the park. Personally I like the unobstructed views but I know at some point, an idiot will hop one of those fences, or a kid will get out of his Tin Lizzy and cause chaos and possibly tragedy.....this is 21st Century America afterall.

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Yeah, I'm mean two fences and the B&M roar wasn't enough to stop that ole' dude from getting his block knocked off.......I will say so far I haven't seen anyone even contemplate hopping the fence into the LR area; I also have not seen anyone in one of the trains with a hat on either. When I worked at RRE we never had problems with someone trying to enter the restricted area until they'd lose a hat and want to get it right then and there.....yay for E-Stops!

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Seriously, I am so tired of hearing/reading all of these extra measures theme parks go to,

to insure that some idiot won't climb over a fence, etc etc etc.....

 

I say, if they get hit or killed, it's their fault, not the park's. Simple.

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Usually that extra fence denotes a danger zone, from a restricted zone. All of the under LR area is probably a danger zone, but that still isn't stopping an idiot from going in there.

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I visited briefly on Memorial Day. The crowds weren't that bad, at least in the front of the park. Waited less than an hour for Lightning Run and that was with it breaking down for about 10-15 minutes. Don't expect to get a season pass processed quickly though.
Going by opening weekend it will be busy but planning should make it tolerable. I would absolutely run to Thunder Run and ride it first; then double back and hit Fear Fall. The wait last Sunday for Thunder Run was an hour around 5-7pm, even with very very quick dispatch times. Lightning Run's wait was only around 30 min when the line was stretching out past to BBQ resturant. It was not too bad at all; I can't vouch for the other rides wait times. If you are trying to do Deep Water Dive prepare to wait, it'll probably busy.

Thanks guys! Is Deluge still closed? The park's website states that all of the water attractions are open, but reports from last weekend said it was closed with a lot of work to do...

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Seriously, I am so tired of hearing/reading all of these extra measures theme parks go to,

to insure that some idiot won't climb over a fence, etc etc etc.....

 

I say, if they get hit or killed, it's their fault, not the park's. Simple.

True but the park will still be blamed and receive a plethora of bad press.

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I'm studying mechanical engineering and my parents are both industrial engineers, so I know a considerable amount about why this happens.

 

The reason it does that is because allowing it to be flexible helps it absorb the forces a bit more. Ever notice how tall trees sway in the wind without falling over or how palm trees bend in hurricanes? This is sort of nature's way of demonstrating this. Skyscrapers sway in the wind similarly. Even wooden coasters can visibly be seen deflecting sometimes. It's about absorbing the force instead of withstanding it.

 

If I'm correct, this is what killed Kings Island's original Bat. It was built too rigidly and the structure couldn't move with the train and it caused structural problems. I might be wrong but that's what I thought caused it. Some B&M track connectors are visibly made to be able to accommodate deflecting track, Mantis's are a good example.

 

I just finished my junior year in Mechanical Engineering, (take a wild guess as to why) so the nerd in me is unable to resist piggybacking on what you said and must educate the uninformed.

 

Every solid material acts like a spring; when a force is applied to the object, it will deflect to some degree. Objects don't technically rupture from forces, but rather pressures or stresses (a force divided by the area over which it acts.) Under a certain range of forces, called the elastic range, the object will just bounce back from its original shape. Beyond this range is called the plastic range, where once an object is stressed enough, it will permanently deform, either only partially returning to its original shape or not returning to its original shape by any amount. Then, after a certain point, it physically ruptures. Note that not all materials undergo significant deformation before rupturing; Those that do are considered ductile (copper) and those that don't are considered brittle (concrete.)

 

Also, there is the concept of fatigue, where after a force is repeated a certain number of times, the part will actually rupture at forces well below the elastic limit (the highest stress in the elastic range.) Some materials, (mostly steels) have what is known as an "endurance limit," where if a repeated stress is applied at or below this value, the stress can be applied an infinite number of times. The exact causes of fatigue are not known (which surprised me when I learned about this last semester) but what I've been able to gather is that one of the main causes is that defects in the material's microscopic structure concentrate the stresses and produce cracks, which propagate until the part breaks.

 

Since I'm not employed by Chance-Morgan, I can't say exactly whether or not they designed the supports and track to withstand stresses below their endurance limits or not, but my guess is that they actually didn't, and probably designed them to last several million cycles instead, as that those stress limits are quite a bit higher, meaning they can use a lot less material.

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Seriously, I am so tired of hearing/reading all of these extra measures theme parks go to,

to insure that some idiot won't climb over a fence, etc etc etc.....

 

I say, if they get hit or killed, it's their fault, not the park's. Simple.

Never worked in Loss Prevention I take it? lol
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Just had to share this great GP comment from a girl that just came into my store to buy a KI ticket.

 

She didn't want to spend the $34 on a KI ticket and I was like well we have a great deal on KK season passes and you pay for it in two visits. Her response was how do they expect me to go there when they have no coasters that go upside down. So I tried to tell her that well the new coaster they have is amazing and then there is the waterpark. She told me if she wanted to ride a coaster that went up and down she would just ride in a car.

 

UGH!!

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Also, there is the concept of fatigue, where after a force is repeated a certain number of times, the part will actually rupture at forces well below the elastic limit (the highest stress in the elastic range.) Some materials, (mostly steels) have what is known as an "endurance limit," where if a repeated stress is applied at or below this value, the stress can be applied an infinite number of times. The exact causes of fatigue are not known (which surprised me when I learned about this last semester) but what I've been able to gather is that one of the main causes is that defects in the material's microscopic structure concentrate the stresses and produce cracks, which propagate until the part breaks.

 

I am studying Materials Science and Engineering and the main cause of fatigue is cyclic loading, the material is exposed to either periods of tension and then compression or tension and then returns to normal. So once a microscopic crack appears in the material, the cycles of differing forces cause the crack to grow with each cycle until it gets to a critical size causing the failure.

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I'm studying mechanical engineering and my parents are both industrial engineers, so I know a considerable amount about why this happens.

 

The reason it does that is because allowing it to be flexible helps it absorb the forces a bit more. Ever notice how tall trees sway in the wind without falling over or how palm trees bend in hurricanes? This is sort of nature's way of demonstrating this. Skyscrapers sway in the wind similarly. Even wooden coasters can visibly be seen deflecting sometimes. It's about absorbing the force instead of withstanding it.

 

If I'm correct, this is what killed Kings Island's original Bat. It was built too rigidly and the structure couldn't move with the train and it caused structural problems. I might be wrong but that's what I thought caused it. Some B&M track connectors are visibly made to be able to accommodate deflecting track, Mantis's are a good example.

 

I just finished my junior year in Mechanical Engineering, (take a wild guess as to why) so the nerd in me is unable to resist piggybacking on what you said and must educate the uninformed.

 

Every solid material acts like a spring; when a force is applied to the object, it will deflect to some degree. Objects don't technically rupture from forces, but rather pressures or stresses (a force divided by the area over which it acts.) Under a certain range of forces, called the elastic range, the object will just bounce back from its original shape. Beyond this range is called the plastic range, where once an object is stressed enough, it will permanently deform, either only partially returning to its original shape or not returning to its original shape by any amount. Then, after a certain point, it physically ruptures. Note that not all materials undergo significant deformation before rupturing; Those that do are considered ductile (copper) and those that don't are considered brittle (concrete.)

 

Also, there is the concept of fatigue, where after a force is repeated a certain number of times, the part will actually rupture at forces well below the elastic limit (the highest stress in the elastic range.) Some materials, (mostly steels) have what is known as an "endurance limit," where if a repeated stress is applied at or below this value, the stress can be applied an infinite number of times. The exact causes of fatigue are not known (which surprised me when I learned about this last semester) but what I've been able to gather is that one of the main causes is that defects in the material's microscopic structure concentrate the stresses and produce cracks, which propagate until the part breaks.

 

Since I'm not employed by Chance-Morgan, I can't say exactly whether or not they designed the supports and track to withstand stresses below their endurance limits or not, but my guess is that they actually didn't, and probably designed them to last several million cycles instead, as that those stress limits are quite a bit higher, meaning they can use a lot less material.

I will be studying Mechanical engineering. It's great to learn about all these knowledge, thanks!

 

If the support swings a lot, would it cause too much pressure to the bolts that connects the support and the footer? Does track and support swinging has anything to do with the loose bolt issues on Smiler and Volcano?

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^You are correct, it will affect the bolts. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the actual swaying of the track would cause the support to move and deflect, and all this would more likely strip the threads of the nuts and bolts, and instead the vibrations that the track encounters would actually loosen them; this can be mitigated by using certain kinds of nuts (jam nuts, etc.) or using two or more nuts right next to each other (this is how coaster supports tend to be constructed) and cars and aviation vehicles often use bolts with very fine threading to minimize this as well, because they encounter lots of vibrations. The possibility also exists that the construction crews didn't tighten the bolts enough, and that the mechanics didn't inspect the track of those rides properly.

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I will be studying Mechanical engineering. It's great to learn about all these knowledge, thanks!

Me too. It's funny how I always wanted to become a mechanical engineer long before I knew it was useful for amusement ride designing.

Now I want it even more

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The hour wait sign that used to be in Lightning Run's queue seems to be gone. I didn't see it, unless I wasn't looking hard enough.

 

Our wait was about 20 people out the entrance both times we rode and we were on the ride within 30-40 minutes. There's a concrete pad to the left when you pass the entrance sign, I wonder if that'll be used for a switchback eventually.

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Does anyone know why the park still has not gotten an entrance sign. It would not seem so strange if they did not still have the old six flags entrance sign still there empty. They really need to get a sign or take down the frame.

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