Obama or McCain or Beemerboy?

[cfc]

^That's the reason I still feel that McCain's pick wasn't a completely odd move. She's for drilling in areas that are currently off-limits (to save the animals and environment despite the fact that with modern-day technology, this shouldn't be a problem) and I feel that if we can stop depending on foreign oil completely, if only for a decade or even as little as five years, we would have time to rebuild our economy and improve our energy resources to the point of not needing oil (which is entirely possible, people are just too lazy to make a move and start using renewable resources). That would hopefully keep us out of the Middle East for a long while, and would help return the world to a state of normalcy (well, as normal as it was before we f'ed up Iraq).

 

Drilling offshore or in ANWAR won't curb our dependence on foreign oil at all. The U.S. uses 25 percent of the world's supply, yet our oil fields (including those that haven't been tapped) make up about 3 percent. Plus, it'll take a good ten years or so to get those wells to produce.

[jmicha]

^Yes, according to some sources. Other sources predict that there is a much larger supply of oil in North America than what you are saying. We really don't know, but any drilling in our own country will help us reduce or eventually eliminate our dependancy on foreign oil. And I understand that since the infrastructure is not there, it will take a while to do this, but if we can put efforts towards drilling in our own country, that would produce jobs in construction and opperation of all the parts involved in removing and moving said oil. And hopefully by the time we begin to produce this oil, our economy will have rebounded at least somewhat from the slump it is in now, which will help us use the money earned from the drilling of this oil to create power plants that use the boundless amounts of renewable resources that are readily available to us. My wording was poor in my last post, as I did not mean to say that it would completely eliminate our dependancy on foreign oils, but it would help reduce it, which, if used stategically, could help us further reduce this need in the future and leave us eventually being completely self-sustainable when it comes to energy.

[crispy]

Sarah Palin was, in a word, Impressive

 

If you agree with her or not, to be under that kind of pressure, and be able to speak as strongly as that was very impressive.

 

I do believe I know why McCain chose her, now I REALLY can't wait for the VP debates

[ginzo]

Sarah Palin was, in a word, Impressive

 

If you agree with her or not, to be under that kind of pressure, and be able to speak as strongly as that was very impressive.

 

I do believe I know why McCain chose her, now I REALLY can't wait for the VP debates

 

Eh, her performance was decent: The Gettysburg Address it was not.

[Sean Menefee]

An Alaskans take on the RNC tonight:

 

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/09/03/here-we-go-rnc-watch-open-thread/

[mr_teisco_delrey]

Sarah Palin was, in a word, Impressive

 

If you agree with her or not, to be under that kind of pressure, and be able to speak as strongly as that was very impressive.

 

I do believe I know why McCain chose her, now I REALLY can't wait for the VP debates

 

Eh, her performance was decent: The Gettysburg Address it was not.

 

It was a good address. She didn't need to do a Gettysburg. If Lincoln had delivered Gettysburg today, he would have been panned since he was a Republican.

[ginzo]

It was a good address. She didn't need to do a Gettysburg. If Lincoln had delivered Gettysburg today, he would have been panned since he was a Republican.

 

Disingenuous. The Republican Party of the 1860s was a very different animal when compared to today.

[cfc]

^Amen to that. I often wonder what happened to the party of Abe Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt.

[Moose]

^Religion.

[Sean Menefee]

From AP on the front page of Yahoo at the moment:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080904/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_fact_check

 

Attacks, praise stretch truth at GOP convention

 

By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer Wed Sep 3, 11:48 PM ET

 

ST. PAUL, Minn. - Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and her Republican supporters held back little Wednesday as they issued dismissive attacks on Barack Obama and flattering praise on her credentials to be vice president. In some cases, the reproach and the praise stretched the truth.

 

Some examples:

 

PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

 

THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

 

PALIN: "There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform — not even in the state senate."

 

THE FACTS: Compared to McCain and his two decades in the Senate, Obama does have a more meager record. But he has worked with Republicans to pass legislation that expanded efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to help destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. The legislation became law last year. To demean that accomplishment would be to also demean the work of Republican Sen. Richard Lugar of Indiana, a respected foreign policy voice in the Senate. In Illinois, he was the leader on two big, contentious measures in Illinois: studying racial profiling by police and requiring recordings of interrogations in potential death penalty cases. He also successfully co-sponsored major ethics reform legislation.

 

PALIN: "The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes, raise payroll taxes, raise investment income taxes, raise the death tax, raise business taxes, and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars."

 

THE FACTS: The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.

 

Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

 

He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise.

 

MCCAIN: "She's been governor of our largest state, in charge of 20 percent of America's energy supply ... She's responsible for 20 percent of the nation's energy supply. I'm entertained by the comparison and I hope we can keep making that comparison that running a political campaign is somehow comparable to being the executive of the largest state in America," he said in an interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson.

 

THE FACTS: McCain's phrasing exaggerates both claims. Palin is governor of a state that ranks second nationally in crude oil production, but she's no more "responsible" for that resource than President Bush was when he was governor of Texas, another oil-producing state. In fact, her primary power is the ability to tax oil, which she did in concert with the Alaska Legislature. And where Alaska is the largest state in America, McCain could as easily have called it the 47th largest state — by population.

 

MCCAIN: "She's the commander of the Alaska National Guard. ... She has been in charge, and she has had national security as one of her primary responsibilities," he said on ABC.

 

THE FACTS: While governors are in charge of their state guard units, that authority ends whenever those units are called to actual military service. When guard units are deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, for example, they assume those duties under "federal status," which means they report to the Defense Department, not their governors. Alaska's national guard units have a total of about 4,200 personnel, among the smallest of state guard organizations.

 

FORMER ARKANSAS GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE: Palin "got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States."

 

THE FACTS: A whopper. Palin got 616 votes in the 1996 mayor's election, and got 909 in her 1999 re-election race, for a total of 1,525. Biden dropped out of the race after the Iowa caucuses, but he still got 76,165 votes in 23 states and the District of Columbia where he was on the ballot during the 2008 presidential primaries.

 

FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOV. MITT ROMNEY: "We need change, all right — change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington! We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington — throw out the big-government liberals, and elect John McCain and Sarah Palin."

 

THE FACTS: A Back-to-the-Future moment. George W. Bush, a conservative Republican, has been president for nearly eight years. And until last year, Republicans controlled Congress. Only since January 2007 have Democrats have been in charge of the House and Senate.

 

___

 

Associated Press Writer Jim Drinkard in Washington contributed to this report.

[slither37]

^^ Strange, you did not put the info from after Obama's speech last week. Not sure why you did not do that. But here it is:

 

 

 

Fact check: Obama's nomination acceptance speech

 

07:57 AM CDT on Friday, August 29, 2008

 

The claim: John McCain defines middle-class as "someone making under $5 million a year."

 

 

 

Fact check: Obama's nomination acceptance speech

 

 

The facts: Asked this month by evangelical leader Rick Warren to define "rich," Mr. McCain joked "How about $5 million?" It followed a comment that wealth does not equal happiness and he wants to spread wealth to more people.

 

The claim: Mr. McCain said the U.S. could just "muddle through" in Afghanistan.

 

The facts: Mr. McCain, answering a question in 2003, said there were clearly parts of Afghanistan that were not under control. But he used "muddle through" to indicate he believed progress could be made under President Hamid Karzai.

 

The claim: That one of Mr. McCain's top advisers, former Texas Sen. Phil Gramm, said the U.S. was in a "mental recession" and had become a "nation of whiners."

 

The facts: Mr. Gramm did say that; Mr. McCain repudiated the remarks. Mr. Gramm resigned as a campaign co-chairman but later returned in an informal advisory role.

 

 

The claim: Mr. McCain wants to "privatize Social Security and gamble your retirement."

 

The facts: Mr. McCain has supported plans to let workers invest some of their payroll taxes in private accounts. He has proposed that up to 20 percent of such taxes go into private accounts for younger workers, not full privatization.

 

 

The claim: John McCain thinks that President Bush "was right more than 90 percent of the time."

 

The facts: Mr. McCain has voted to support the Bush administration's position 89 percent of the time since 2001, according to Congressional Quarterly. But he has supported Mr. Bush as little as 77 percent of the time in 2005, and congressional votes are an imperfect measure of how one views a president's judgment.

 

 

and more from factcheck.org:

 

Summary

We checked the accuracy of Obama's speech accepting the Democratic nomination, and noted the following:

 

Obama said he could “pay for every dime” of his spending and tax cut proposals “by closing corporate loopholes and tax havens.” That’s wrong – his proposed tax increases on upper-income individuals are key components of paying for his program, as well. And his plan, like McCain’s, would leave the U.S. facing big budget deficits, according to independent experts.

He twisted McCain’s words about Afghanistan, saying, “When John McCain said we could just 'muddle through' in Afghanistan, I argued for more resources.” Actually, McCain said in 2003 we “may” muddle through, and he recently also called for more troops there.

 

 

He said McCain would fail to lower taxes for 100 million Americans while his own plan would cut taxes for 95 percent of “working” families. But an independent analysis puts the number who would see no benefit from McCain’s plan at 66 million and finds that Obama’s plan would benefit 81 percent of all households when retirees and those without children are figured in.

Obama asked why McCain would "define middle-class as someone making under five million dollars a year"? Actually, McCain meant that comment as a joke, getting a laugh and following up by saying, "But seriously ..."

Obama noted that McCain’s health care plan would "tax people’s benefits" but didn’t say that it also would provide up to a $5,000 tax credit for families.

 

 

He said McCain, far from being a maverick who’s "broken with his party," has voted to support Bush policies 90 percent of the time. True enough, but by the same measure Obama has voted with fellow Democrats in the Senate 97 percent of the time.

 

 

Obama said "average family income" went down $2,000 under Bush, which isn't correct. An aide said he was really talking only about "working" families and not retired couples. And – math teachers, please note – he meant median (or midpoint) and not really the mean or average. Median family income actually has inched up slightly under Bush.

 

Analysis

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama accepted his party's nomination Aug. 28, speaking before more than 84,000 people in Denver's Mile High football stadium. Some of his comments were worthy of a ref's yellow flag.

 

 

Not Quite Every Dime

 

 

Obama reassured voters that he can pay for all his spending proposals:

 

Obama: Now, many of these plans will cost money, which is why I’ve laid out how I’ll pay for every dime – by closing corporate loopholes and tax havens that don’t help America grow.

 

This is misleading. Even by his own campaign’s estimates, closing corporate loopholes and tax havens won’t pay for all of Obama’s new plans. In July, the campaign told the Los Angeles Times that they estimate the yearly cost of their proposed tax cuts at $130 billion. They put revenue from closing tax loopholes at just $80 billion. Obama also proposes to raise taxes to pre-Bush levels for families earning more than $250,000 a year and singles making more than $200,000, yielding additional revenue. But he didn't mention that in his speech.

 

But Obama’s claim is misleading on another level. According to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, "without substantial cuts in government spending" Obama’s plan – and McCain's, too – "would substantially increase the national debt over the next ten years." Obama spokesman Tommy Vietor told FactCheck.org that the Tax Policy Center's analysis "fails to take in account Senator Obama's spending cuts, including ending the Iraq war." That's true, but Obama's proposed cuts are dwarfed by the Tax Policy Center's projected deficits. Obama’s new spending programs might be completely offset by new revenue and spending cuts. But overall spending will still exceed overall revenue, and the nation would face at least 10 more years of annual deficits.

 

 

Afghan Muddle

 

Obama twisted McCain's words about Afghanistan, incorrectly implying that McCain saw no need for more troops there.

 

Obama: When John McCain said we could just “muddle through” in Afghanistan, I argued for more resources and more troops to finish the fight against the terrorists who actually attacked us on 9/11

 

Actually, McCain said in 2003 that the U.S. "may" muddle through, not that we could or would. He also said he was very concerned about a rise in al Qaeda activity there. He said then that he was "guardedly optimistic" that the government could handle it.

 

McCain, 2003: I think Afghanistan is dicey. I think that there are certain areas of the country, particularly along the Pakistani border, that are clearly not under the control of either Pakistan or the Afghan government. ... There has been a rise in al Qaeda activity along the border. There has been some increase in U.S. casualties. I am concerned about it, but I'm not as concerned as I am about Iraq today, obviously, or I'd be talking about Afghanistan. But I believe that if Karzai can make the progress that he is making, that – in the long term, we may muddle through in Afghanistan.

 

So I'm guardedly optimistic, but I am also realistic that the central government in Kabul has very little effect on the policies and practices of the warlords who control the surrounding areas.

 

Recently, however, both candidates have called for an increased troop presence in Afghanistan. In July, Obama proposed sending two more combat brigades, drawn down from Iraq. McCain immediately followed this with a call for three more brigades, but later clarified that some of those troops would be NATO forces. A McCain spokeswoman said that the U.S. would "contribute" troops to the increase under McCain's plan.

 

Tax Spin

 

 

Obama said: “I will cut taxes ... for 95 percent of all working families.” And he said McCain proposes “not one penny of tax relief to more than 100 million Americans,” a claim his running mate, Joe Biden, made the night before.

 

Obama is right about his plan's effect on working families. More broadly, though, the plan cuts taxes for 81.3 percent of all households in 2009, according to the Tax Policy Center. The TPC also says McCain’s tax plan would leave 65.8 million households without a cut, not 100 million.

 

The TPC’s calculations factor in what's in effect a hidden tax on individuals that results from taxing corporations. McCain proposes to lower the corporate income tax rate, and Obama proposes billions of dollars in increased corporate taxes in the form of “loophole closings.” Individuals wouldn’t experience those changes as an increased tax bill from the government, but both the Congressional Budget Office and TPC allocate all corporate tax to owners of capital rather than to consumers. That means rather than flowing through to consumers in the form of higher prices or lower wages, corporate tax changes would show up as higher or lower returns on investments, which typically come in the form of corporate dividends, and profits or losses from stock sales.

 

Only by ignoring the hidden benefit to individuals can McCain’s plan be said to produce no cut for 100 million households. According to a calculation the TPC did at FactCheck's request, 101.9 million see no benefit if the effects of a corporate reduction are set aside.

 

For the record, Obama aides say the indirect effect on holders of capital won't be as large as TPC says. "We dispute TPC's methodology here," says Brian Deese of the Obama campaign. He says several of the "loophole closers" that Obama is proposing won't affect corporations or are on offshore activity that will not directly filter through.

 

We'd also note that retirees would fare quite a bit less well than working families under Obama's tax plan: The TPC estimates that 32 percent of households with a person over age 65 would see a tax increase.

 

 

Rich Humor

 

 

Obama used a clumsy attempt at humor by McCain as evidence of his supposed insensitivity to middle-class economic realities:

 

Obama: Now, I don't believe that Senator McCain doesn't care what's going on in the lives of Americans; I just think he doesn’t know. Why else would he define middle-class as someone making under five million dollars a year?

 

What McCain actually said at the Saddleback Church forum on Aug. 16 was that he favors low taxes for all income levels. He drew a laugh, then said, "but seriously" as he struggled to make his point:

 

Pastor Rick Warren, Aug. 16: [G]ive me a number, give me a specific number - where do you move from middle class to rich?

 

McCain: I don't want to take any money from the rich – I want everybody to get rich. ... So, I think if you are just talking about income, how about $5 million?

 

(LAUGHTER)

 

But seriously, I don't think you can - I don't think seriously that - the point is that I'm trying to make here, seriously – and I'm sure that comment will be distorted – but the point is that we want to keep people's taxes low and increase revenues.

 

Health Care Half Truths

 

 

Obama gave only half the story when he described a feature of McCain's health care plan:

 

Obama: How else could he offer a health care plan that would actually tax people’s benefits...

 

McCain proposes to grant families up to a $5,000 tax credit to use for health benefits. The flip side of that proposal, which McCain seldom if ever mentions, is that the value of employer-sponsored benefits would also become taxable. Both candidates are trading in half-truths here; McCain talks only about the pleasurable side of his plan, while Obama's speech mentioned only the painful aspect. Neither gives a complete picture.

 

 

Party Hearties

 

 

Obama painted McCain as a Republican partisan who's supported the unpopular President Bush consistently:

 

Obama: And next week, we'll also hear about those occasions when he's broken with his party as evidence that he can deliver the change that we need. But the record's clear: John McCain has voted with George Bush 90 percent of the time.

 

It's true that McCain's voting support for Bush policies has averaged slightly above 89 percent since Bush took office, according to Congressional Quarterly’s vote studies. But it has ebbed and flowed. It reached a low of 77 percent in 2005. Last year it was 95 percent. By comparison, Obama's own record of supporting Bush policies has averaged slightly under 41 percent since the senator took office. However, Obama's voting record is no less partisan than McCain's. He has voted in line with his party an average of nearly 97 percent of the time. The truth is that neither candidate can claim a strong record of "breaking with his party" if Senate votes are the measure.

 

 

He Didn't Mean It

 

 

Obama also pulled some sleight of hand when he stated that "the average American family" saw its income "go down $2,000" under George Bush. That's not correct. Census figures show average family income went down $348.

 

As it turns out, when Obama said "average family income," he didn't mean "average," and he didn't mean "family," either. An Obama aide says he was really referring to median income – which is the midpoint – and not to the average. And Obama was talking only about "working families," not retired couples.

 

For all families, median family income actually inched up under Bush by $272.

 

 

 

 

 

And please let us not forget about the time that Obama's relative helped liberate Auschwitz... oh wait, the Red Army did that.... Oh yes, a pass was given to Obama for this... never mind.

 

 

One other thing from a Obama ad that is incredibly disingenous. He has an ad that says he does not take money from oil companies. This is correct, but it fails to mention that neither does McCain or any other candidate for president since a law was passed in 1907.

 

I agree Palin's speech was not the Gettysburg address, but then again, Obama's was not "I have a Dream" either.

[Sean Menefee]

^ Because most people had already seen the Obama one last week. It wasn't a conspiracy theory or anything. What exactly is strange about that?

 

I was merely pointing out that it was a top headline at Yahoo at the moment.

 

-Sean

[slither37]

Fair enough, since I do not believe anyone posted it, last week, it is here now.

[crispy]

WOW!!

 

Well, what can I say

 

Just like Obama keeps harping on McCain for saying Middle class is anyone earning under $5 Million ( A joke by McCain, by the way), I can see that the slant against Sarah Palin is still in force

 

As a mayor of a small town, she was acting in the best intrest of her town, that was her focus, tell me you would not do the same thing, Federal polotics was not on her radar at that point, very unfair

 

The bridge to nowhere WAS initially supported by Sarah Palin, the she decided that it was not the best way to spend alot of money, Obama has change position during the presidentail campain, why can't Palin change her position as a governor

 

As for Obama's record, The fact remains, and as wierd as it sounds, Obama HAS written two Memiors, and never wrote or inacted any major law or spearheaded any change to the status quo in washington

 

McCain HAS fought even his own party to change the influence of Big Tabacco, Election finance reform, and many many others, if you take the time to look at his record, you may be suprised, and then you would understand that Obama trying to cast him as the tird term of Bush is not only innacurate is laughably funny

 

As for Palin experience, she has run a state, balanced a budget, negtiated some serous deals for her state with big oil, and the group building the natural gas pipeline, she has delt with serious energy issues, Obama has done none of this, and as one Alaska democrat put is, the polical landscape of Alaska is littered with the people who have underestimated her.

 

The national Guard, she actually went to the middle east and met with her troops from Alaske, so that gives her about as much time over there as Obama

 

This can go round and round, the fact remians, peoples choices are very personal, but the attacks against Palin this past week have seriously been very pathetic, and extremly personal, I applaud her for taking the attacks, the "contibutors" who questioned her ability to be a mother and a VP, she stood up to that and showed them why her approval rating is around 80 to 85%, she is impressive

[mcjaco]

From Yahoo:

 

ST. PAUL, Minn. - Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and her Republican supporters held back little Wednesday as they issued dismissive attacks on Barack Obama and flattering praise on her credentials to be vice president. In some cases, the reproach and the praise stretched the truth.

 

Some examples:

 

PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

 

THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

 

PALIN: "There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform — not even in the state senate."

 

THE FACTS: Compared to McCain and his two decades in the Senate, Obama does have a more meager record. But he has worked with Republicans to pass legislation that expanded efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to help destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. The legislation became law last year. To demean that accomplishment would be to also demean the work of Republican Sen. Richard Lugar of Indiana, a respected foreign policy voice in the Senate. In Illinois, he was the leader on two big, contentious measures in Illinois: studying racial profiling by police and requiring recordings of interrogations in potential death penalty cases. He also successfully co-sponsored major ethics reform legislation.

 

PALIN: "The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes, raise payroll taxes, raise investment income taxes, raise the death tax, raise business taxes, and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars."

 

THE FACTS: The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.

 

Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

 

He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise.

 

MCCAIN: "She's been governor of our largest state, in charge of 20 percent of America's energy supply ... She's responsible for 20 percent of the nation's energy supply. I'm entertained by the comparison and I hope we can keep making that comparison that running a political campaign is somehow comparable to being the executive of the largest state in America," he said in an interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson.

 

THE FACTS: McCain's phrasing exaggerates both claims. Palin is governor of a state that ranks second nationally in crude oil production, but she's no more "responsible" for that resource than President Bush was when he was governor of Texas, another oil-producing state. In fact, her primary power is the ability to tax oil, which she did in concert with the Alaska Legislature. And where Alaska is the largest state in America, McCain could as easily have called it the 47th largest state — by population.

 

MCCAIN: "She's the commander of the Alaska National Guard. ... She has been in charge, and she has had national security as one of her primary responsibilities," he said on ABC.

 

THE FACTS: While governors are in charge of their state guard units, that authority ends whenever those units are called to actual military service. When guard units are deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, for example, they assume those duties under "federal status," which means they report to the Defense Department, not their governors. Alaska's national guard units have a total of about 4,200 personnel, among the smallest of state guard organizations.

 

FORMER ARKANSAS GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE: Palin "got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States."

 

THE FACTS: A whopper. Palin got 616 votes in the 1996 mayor's election, and got 909 in her 1999 re-election race, for a total of 1,525. Biden dropped out of the race after the Iowa caucuses, but he still got 76,165 votes in 23 states and the District of Columbia where he was on the ballot during the 2008 presidential primaries.

 

FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOV. MITT ROMNEY: "We need change, all right — change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington! We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington — throw out the big-government liberals, and elect John McCain and Sarah Palin."

 

THE FACTS: A Back-to-the-Future moment. George W. Bush, a conservative Republican, has been president for nearly eight years. And until last year, Republicans controlled Congress. Only since January 2007 have Democrats have been in charge of the House and Senate.

 

Once again, this thread was merely a "Who are you voting for" Poll. Not a raising the issues, I'm part of this party, you're an idiot if you're not with me, so and so is a liar, etc. Post who you're voting for an move on.

[slither37]

^^ I agree with you about the attacks on Palin.

 

I do find it laughable that the "5 million/year is middle class" is still in Obama's ad. This was said in JEST by McCain and IMMEDIATELY followed with "..Seroiusly....." You do not see McCain ads with Obama mentioning the 57 states visited or when his relative helped liberate Auschwitz (obviously not true)

[mr_teisco_delrey]

^Amen to that. I often wonder what happened to the party of Abe Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt.

I often wonder what happened to the party of JFK and Franklin Roosevelt.

[BeemerBoy]

I'm glad the glitzy, over-the-top, kiss ass mudslinging fests are almost over. Seriously, these conventions remind me of nothing more than a glamorized high school prom king/queen popularity contest.

 

It won't be the same at the PMW convention. I've decided to hold our "convention" next Saturday in the ATL, yo. We're gonna open Centennial Park to the masses, and it'll be like a good 'ole southern backyard barbeque, with tons of PMW for everyone. I'm gonna parade down the street like the Joker in Tim Burton's Batman, tossing out M and W to the crowd while Prince jams on the float behind me with plenty of P dancing onboard.

 

After that, Larry and I will address the crowd, followed by a special guest performance by Lil' Wayne (naturally). Heck, he may even perform his own version of the Simpsons' Monorail song.

 

 

Oh, and by the way, I write all my own speeches.

[slither37]

^^ Yes, that is what conventions should be all about.

 

Beemerboy (after he "explains" his past comments on the Buckeyes) 2008

[BeemerBoy]

^ I'm holding out on my OSU thoughts for now.

 

 

Also, there will be plenty of huge flat screen displays to take in all the college football action. We leave no rock unturned.

[slither37]

SCANDALOUS?!?!?!?!?

 

Just why IS Beemberboy holding his comments on OSU????? Is he really a closet Buckeye fan and is waiting until the perfect politically opportune time to reveal this to the nation?

Hmmmmm, I smell a cover-up... or is that just some W.... hmmm, no wait, I think it is just some W....never mind, no cover up...

 

In other news, I am off to find some Ho-Hos and some Fritos.....

[PKI Jizzman]

Just moments ago, Scott unleashes his proposal on the "Golden Tickets" conspiracy.

 

Yes. I plan on nixing the "Golden Tickets," and introducing the amusement world's form of the "Razzies." It's much more fun to vote on the worst of what the industry has to offer.

 

That's raw power right there.

[ginzo]

I'm glad the glitzy, over-the-top, kiss a$$ mudslinging fests are almost over. Seriously, these conventions remind me of nothing more than a glamorized high school prom king/queen popularity contest.

 

I'm with you on that, bro. Political conventions are giant circle jerks for smug political true believers (aka born followers) to either get inappropriately dewy eyed as in the case of Obama's speech or engage in some good ole fashion jingoistic chest pounding and chanting of "U-S-A" as in the case of last night. While I guess some people enjoy them, they're definitely not my scene.

 

I don't want power or fame, just PMW.

[crispy]

^^ Yes, that is what conventions should be all about.

 

Beemerboy (after he "explains" his past comments on the Buckeyes) 2008

 

EXACTLY, they are speeches and the like that attack the other canidate, justified or not, and speak to the party's base, both are the same, and both have had great conventions

[Coasterfanatic245]

Sarah made an unbelievable speech last night!!

 

McCain/Palin 2008!!!