Kings Island (KI) Discussion Thread

[Invertalon]

I will admit... the only thing I dislike about this addition is how much they “clear cut” for it. . . I wish it would have been more Beast like.... where it runs through/over the trees.

 

Instead of the “remove any and all trees within 50ft of the blueprint” approach.

 

It’s like Time Traveler at SDC. Amazing ride, however... the clear cutting around the ride makes it stand out like a sore thumb when compared to the other attractions like Thunderation, Powder Keg, and Outlaw Run.

 

I mean, you have to remember to put up a ride of this scale, they need land to position the cranes and other equipment to safely get the ride up. If you look up old construction photos of the beast, they also cleared the land immediate to the ride, naturally. It just had many, many years to re-grow back in. Also, they wouldn't need to clear as much land as it's just lumber versus having to stage large cranes capable of lifting very heavy components 300ft in the air!

 

That being said, hopefully they will fill in the land again with new tree's and such once complete.

[Pedrinho]

^

Well, when you look at onride POVs from Banshee on media day and compare it to how it looks now, you'll see that KI is at least trying to do that job.

[RAWKIN_coaster38]

Love the update!!!!! Was gonna say hi when I saw you when i ran into one of the FYE Coaster guys but didnt wanna intrude haha looking forward to more of your reports!

You should have! Sorry if I saw you and didn't recognize you. I was meeting so many new people from their group that I just assumed I didn't know anyone.

[KIEnthusiast]

Steel Vengeance was built for enthusiasts and every enthusiast in the whole world went to Cedar Point last year to ride it.

 

Yeah. No.

 

There are TONS air coaster enthusiasts who didn’t flock out to Cedar Point for SV. (Myself being one of them.)

 

You all are missing my point, which still stands. Cedar Point built Steel Vengeance for coaster enthusiasts, but nobody came. Ergo, enthusiasts do not make up a large percentage of park attendance.

[prozach626]

That topic always makes me wonder how many people who go to parks are actually willing to drive more than a few hours, if that, to another park. And I'm not talking about Disney/Orlando, which IMO doesn't qualify since it's more of a destination in itself. I'm talking about people who visit Six Flags Fiesta Texas, Carowinds, Six Flags St. Louis, Holiday World, etc. who are interested in visiting a place like Cedar Point, and then those who follow though. Then, you have to take into account those who can even think to afford to take that kind of trip.

 

I know two other people who are working professionals with decent salaries who have visited Cedar Point out of all of the people I know. But then again, they'll probably never go again. That, and they didn't go because of any new attraction, they just went based on the reputation Cedar Point has had since I was a teenager. So, I'm curious about the actual number of X in 1000 who actually went with the majority of their purpose to ride Steele Vengeance. After that, I'd like to know how many people went for a refurbished ride like Steele Vengeance vs. a new ground-up roller coaster like Valravn or Gatekeeper, both of which also had unique features.

[chschris1]

I live in SC and have been to Cedar Point twice. Kinda wish I had just waited to go until SV had opened. I probably will not go back until there is another major addition.

[AmyUD06]

That topic always makes me wonder how many people who go to parks are actually willing to drive more than a few hours, if that, to another park. And I'm not talking about Disney/Orlando, which IMO doesn't qualify since it's more of a destination in itself. I'm talking about people who visit Six Flags Fiesta Texas, Carowinds, Six Flags St. Louis, Holiday World, etc. who are interested in visiting a place like Cedar Point, and then those who follow though. Then, you have to take into account those who can even think to afford to take that kind of trip.

 

I know two other people who are working professionals with decent salaries who have visited Cedar Point out of all of the people I know. But then again, they'll probably never go again. That, and they didn't go because of any new attraction, they just went based on the reputation Cedar Point has had since I was a teenager. So, I'm curious about the actual number of X in 1000 who actually went with the majority of their purpose to ride Steele Vengeance. After that, I'd like to know how many people went for a refurbished ride like Steele Vengeance vs. a new ground-up roller coaster like Valravn or Gatekeeper, both of which also had unique features.

 

I think you've got a very valid point.

 

I think I fall into the category of "working professionals with decent salaries," consider myself quite an enthusiast, and yeah my only two trips there as an adult were in 2008 and 2017, and the 2017 trip was 50% because I had a work event in Milwaukee to go to and opted to drive from Northern DE instead of fly. Otherwise, CP is about a 9 hour drive for me (I loathe flying), which necessitates taking a day at each end for travel, and of course at least 2 days at the park. If I'm gonna be out there, might as well do KI too, so that adds another day or two. Getting 5-6 days off consecutive can be tough, not to mention the $1,000 for the travel expenses on top of the Platinum Pass. And I travel by myself for the most part LOL.

 

Would I have loved to get out there last year or this year for SV? Absolutely. But it just didn't happen. I hope to get back to CP (and KI for that matter) next summer, but we'll see.

[ZeroGravity55]

Steel Vengeance got me to go to Cedar Point last year. I used the fact that they have like 18 roller coasters to get my friends to go with me. Funny thing is, once I got them on Steel Vengeance, that's the reason they're making the trip again with me next year and spending more money in the process flying and staying at Breakers. They loved it that much. Now if a park has an RMC and I want them to go with me, I tell them it has a ride like SV and they're ready to go. That being said, we're also making the trip to Kings Island again next year for Orion.

[prozach626]

^Sounds like it's time to take them to the one RMC that I actually really liked. If you live in Southern Illinois Outlaw Run is relatively close and calling your name. I'm betting you've been on it, but your friends might be easily sold.

 

Outlaw Run hits the break run just in time to catch your breath. Steele Vengeance keeps going at that point and tries to separate my upper torso from my hips. Eh. Thrashing isn't my thing and I can tell I wouldn't enjoy bull riding. One and done.

 

Just like I just said in the HW thread, I'd be back to SDC if I could enjoy a beer while I take in the atmosphere. Two dry parks within four hours of me sucks. Aside from Haunts, I don't like to throw too many back. But damn. I'm a working professional and I like to enjoy a couple cold ones on getaways. Throw me a bone SDC & HW!

[pǝʇɹǝʌuı]

Steel Vengeance got me to go to Cedar Point last year. I used the fact that they have like 18 roller coasters to get my friends to go with me. Funny thing is, once I got them on Steel Vengeance, that's the reason they're making the trip again with me next year and spending more money in the process flying and staying at Breakers. They loved it that much. Now if a park has an RMC and I want them to go with me, I tell them it has a ride like SV and they're ready to go. That being said, we're also making the trip to Kings Island again next year for Orion.

 

This is an awesome point. And I think it leads back to the thing that's been said over and over in this thread: just because Orion doesn't break any records doesn't mean it's not going to be an awesome ride. When people come and ride this thing, they'll want to keep coming back for more. That's exactly what the park wants, hence the emphasis on gold pass sales.

 

Kings Island could build the world's tallest roller coaster, and once people have ridden it they'll brag about it to their friends and possibly never come back because it was simply too intense. Or they could build a scary-but-not-too-scary, awesome, fun, roller coaster that's taller than anything they currently have and drastically improve their overall park experience, causing more people to want to visit the park more often.

[DILinator]

Locally here in Mid-Michigan, people will definitely make the 3 hour trip to CP for a new, hyped attraction, and if MIA ever DID add another big attraction, you'd better believe they'd flock there en-masse! (Even all the GP I've ever talked with in the area are annoyed with the lack of additions at the park, so anybody saying otherwise is feeding you a company line.) Dive Coasters in particular draw immense interest from non-enthusiasts, and that first year of Valravn was huge as far as attracting local interest. Honestly, I think SV looking a lot like a wooden coaster probably hurt its hype in the GP's eyes, and could explain why it didn't draw as well as we may have expected. Nobody I talked to about it had any context for knowing what an "RMC" was, and the response I got from people (again, all non-enthusiasts, because I don't have many local enthusiast friends) was noticeably more subdued than when I was showing them Valravn a couple of years before. (Heck, all this year I had random people sharing pictures and POVs of Yukon Striker on my Facebook because they know I love coasters, and that one got their attention!) So that's how I've found the non-enthusiast locals to be about Cedar Point. But ask about Six Flags Great America, or Kings Island, and the number of people in this area who have been to (or even heard of) either park, is WAY lower. It's always surprising to me, just how few people have made the trip to either park, and they're only an hour, to an hour and a half farther away. So, I have to agree with the others who have suggested that GP, and non-enthusiasts aren't likely to travel more than a few hours for an amusement park, and will likely only visit a non local park if there happens to be one nearby to where they are vacationing for some other reason.

[Haymaker]

That will probably be one of the more busy days. We've been to KI Haunt twice in the last three years. I can only comment on our experiences. The longest line we've waited in was last year for Diamondback and that was probably 15-20 minutes, if that. Beast and Banshee were 5-10 minutes. Everything else took us practically right into the station. Once the haunt starts the lines for the rides get shorter. Then, during the last few hours the haunted house lines die down. I suggest at least trying one or two.

 

Are those FL waits or standby waits? Thinking of going Oct 4th but would not be buying FL+

[ZeroGravity55]

^Sounds like it's time to take them to the one RMC that I actually really liked. If you live in Southern Illinois Outlaw Run is relatively close and calling your name. I'm betting you've been on it, but your friends might be easily sold.

 

Just like I just said in the HW thread, I'd be back to SDC if I could enjoy a beer while I take in the atmosphere. Two dry parks within four hours of me sucks. Aside from Haunts, I don't like to throw too many back. But damn. I'm a working professional and I like to enjoy a couple cold ones on getaways. Throw me a bone SDC & HW!

 

We all actually went to SDC in April and had a really good time. Time Traveler was actually the favorite of our group! It's funny now that I've gotten them on two more RMC's (Outlaw Run and and Storm Chaser), they refer to them as min-SV's lol.

 

The older I get, the more I agree with you about having a few beers while at the park. While I love HW as it's been the park I've grew up with, we went to HW 4 weeks ago and KK 3 weeks ago and we had a much better time at KK. That was mostly because there was little to no wait for the rides, but also because we were drinking. Could have used a few at HW. When you work with the public and then go to a place on your vacation where there is a ton of people who are very similar to the people you deal with on a daily basis at work, you need something to take the edge off.

 

Dive Coasters in particular draw immense interest from non-enthusiasts, and that first year of Valravn was huge as far as attracting local interest. Honestly, I think SV looking a lot like a wooden coaster probably hurt its hype in the GP's eyes, and could explain why it didn't draw as well as we may have expected. Nobody I talked to about it had any context for knowing what an "RMC" was, and the response I got from people (again, all non-enthusiasts, because I don't have many local enthusiast friends) was noticeably more subdued than when I was showing them Valravn a couple of years before. (Heck, all this year I had random people sharing pictures and POVs of Yukon Striker on my Facebook because they know I love coasters, and that one got their attention!) So that's how I've found the non-enthusiast locals to be about Cedar Point.

 

B&M rides in general are more marketable just because as I've said before, they're so damn beautiful. RMC's are rough and rigid looking, but they also do stuff that looks damn near impossible. SV is very intimidating to look at. My friends GF didn't wanna ride it because of how "scary" looking it was. However, she didn't have a single problem riding Millie or Top Thrill Dragster before we got to SV. As I used to tell my cooks, appearance is everything. You could cook a steak that maybe the best tasting steak ever, but if the outside looks like sh**, nobody is going to eat it.

[Samuel]

 

B&M rides in general are more marketable just because as I've said before, they're so damn beautiful. RMC's are rough and rigid looking, but they also do stuff that looks damn near impossible. SV is very intimidating to look at...appearance is everything. You could cook a steak that maybe the best tasting steak ever, but if the outside looks like sh**, nobody is going to eat it.

 

I don't know, I think Steel Vengeance is the most beautiful-looking coaster I've ever seen -- especially at night. I understand where you're coming from with the B&Ms looking good, though. I'm sure Orion will look great. I didn't ride Steel Vengeance opening year because of its one-train ops, and then it was removed from Fast Lane Plus for a time, and finally because the weather forecast was awful over three straight weekends near the end of the season and I ended up not going. Sometimes it's a lot of little things that aren't the fault of a ride's visual presentation.

[prozach626]

Are those FL waits or standby waits? Thinking of going Oct 4th but would not be buying FL+

 

Those were the Fast Lane Plus lines.

 

When you work with the public and then go to a place on your vacation where there is a ton of people who are very similar to the people you deal with on a daily basis at work, you need something to take the edge off.

 

B&M rides in general are more marketable just because as I've said before, they're so damn beautiful.

 

Amen to both of these statements.

[ZeroGravity55]

 

B&M rides in general are more marketable just because as I've said before, they're so damn beautiful. RMC's are rough and rigid looking, but they also do stuff that looks damn near impossible. SV is very intimidating to look at...appearance is everything. You could cook a steak that maybe the best tasting steak ever, but if the outside looks like sh**, nobody is going to eat it.

 

I don't know, I think Steel Vengeance is the most beautiful-looking coaster I've ever seen -- especially at night. I understand where you're coming from with the B&Ms looking good, though. I'm sure Orion will look great. I didn't ride Steel Vengeance opening year because of its one-train ops, and then it was removed from Fast Lane Plus for a time, and finally because the weather forecast was awful over three straight weekends near the end of the season and I ended up not going. Sometimes it's a lot of little things that aren't the fault of a ride's visual presentation.

 

Oh I think Steel Vengeance is beautiful too, but I'm also a coaster enthusiast lol. I just think that there is a portion of the GP (like my friends GF) that walk up to that ride and take one look at it and say there is no way I'm ever riding it or they get talked into riding, ride it once, then come off saying they'll never ride it again. You're right though, last season was a downer for the whole industry it seems. So it probably isn't fair to judge SV's appeal factor when you factor that in. It'll be interesting to see the ridership numbers for it this year compared to last year (did CP ever release those?).

[DILinator]

Sooo... Haunt Saturdays, and KI all day Saturdays during October... It's probably crazy busy, right? I've only ever gone on Friday nights for Haunt, and haven't found the crowds too bad. But I imagine Saturdays are a whole different beast! What should I expect? (not doing Fast Lane+)

[Pedrinho]

LOL, the first real lift support is already around the same heigth as the racer

It will be an interesting off season for construction cam nerds like me

[Bamwa]

I love a good steel erection.

[VandeSte]

they already have a lift track section up already.

[Pedrinho]

Yeah, that escalates quickly!

[PKI Jizzman]

Here have a screenshot so you can see the erection yourself. Click it for a higher resolution.

[RAWKIN_coaster38]

That topic always makes me wonder how many people who go to parks are actually willing to drive more than a few hours, if that, to another park. And I'm not talking about Disney/Orlando, which IMO doesn't qualify since it's more of a destination in itself. I'm talking about people who visit Six Flags Fiesta Texas, Carowinds, Six Flags St. Louis, Holiday World, etc. who are interested in visiting a place like Cedar Point, and then those who follow though. Then, you have to take into account those who can even think to afford to take that kind of trip.

 

I know two other people who are working professionals with decent salaries who have visited Cedar Point out of all of the people I know. But then again, they'll probably never go again. That, and they didn't go because of any new attraction, they just went based on the reputation Cedar Point has had since I was a teenager. So, I'm curious about the actual number of X in 1000 who actually went with the majority of their purpose to ride Steele Vengeance. After that, I'd like to know how many people went for a refurbished ride like Steele Vengeance vs. a new ground-up roller coaster like Valravn or Gatekeeper, both of which also had unique features.

I think you have a really great point here. I know there are plenty of people who would go to CP because of its reputation whether there is a new ride or not. In that case, current economics might be a better indicator to whether people will come or not. I don't think last year was the best year.

 

Locally here in Mid-Michigan, people will definitely make the 3 hour trip to CP for a new, hyped attraction, and if MIA ever DID add another big attraction, you'd better believe they'd flock there en-masse! (Even all the GP I've ever talked with in the area are annoyed with the lack of additions at the park, so anybody saying otherwise is feeding you a company line.) Dive Coasters in particular draw immense interest from non-enthusiasts, and that first year of Valravn was huge as far as attracting local interest. Honestly, I think SV looking a lot like a wooden coaster probably hurt its hype in the GP's eyes, and could explain why it didn't draw as well as we may have expected. Nobody I talked to about it had any context for knowing what an "RMC" was, and the response I got from people (again, all non-enthusiasts, because I don't have many local enthusiast friends) was noticeably more subdued than when I was showing them Valravn a couple of years before. (Heck, all this year I had random people sharing pictures and POVs of Yukon Striker on my Facebook because they know I love coasters, and that one got their attention!) So that's how I've found the non-enthusiast locals to be about Cedar Point. But ask about Six Flags Great America, or Kings Island, and the number of people in this area who have been to (or even heard of) either park, is WAY lower. It's always surprising to me, just how few people have made the trip to either park, and they're only an hour, to an hour and a half farther away. So, I have to agree with the others who have suggested that GP, and non-enthusiasts aren't likely to travel more than a few hours for an amusement park, and will likely only visit a non local park if there happens to be one nearby to where they are vacationing for some other reason.

You're right. A ton of people thought Steel Vengeance would still be rough because Mean Streak was rough. It was hard to explain to them the difference. I'm sure popularity has/will increase the more people ride it and tell their friends how it is.

 

My only concern with Orion is that I'm already hearing GP comparing it to Diamondback, saying the park is basically just adding another Diamondback. Of course it'll get a lot of traffic from locals who would go to the park anyway, but I have no idea how it'll be received by people from further away. In general, I don't meet too many people in the park who come from further places than MI, OH, KY, and IN anyway. But I might be completely off base. Only time will tell.

 

Sooo... Haunt Saturdays, and KI all day Saturdays during October... It's probably crazy busy, right? I've only ever gone on Friday nights for Haunt, and haven't found the crowds too bad. But I imagine Saturdays are a whole different beast! What should I expect? (not doing Fast Lane+)

I intentionally avoid Saturdays (and work most Saturdays anyway) but I heard this last Saturday the parking line was backed up into the road within a few hours of opening. That's a really bad indication of how busy the park will be. Too bad none of the webcams are facing that way or you could use that to judge whether it's worth your time going. I can have my friends gauge it if they go this Saturday.

[mudvayneimn]

I went last Saturday....spent an inadvertent hour waiting for Invertigo, and directly after, went for Fastlane Plus.... I rode every coaster but FOF, and the Bat (mainly because of me being blown away from my first night ride of the Beast, and my first ride of Mystic Timbers ever was so phenomenal, that my partner and I could not stand walking past them, without one more ride, on our way to Vortex after riding DIamondback.

 

I held us up because I needed to process my pass. So the first 1 1/2 hours were spent "outside" of the park.

[DILinator]

Yeah, so that's a heck no for me then! I'll just stick to Friday nights!