Canada's Wonderland Discussion Thread

[Tmcdllr]

^I will be honest. I totally want to argue with you on your points. But you know what, what you have said really makes sense. I have to agree. Well said.

[yankees15]

^ I agree. The pre-drop gives the train a running start on the drop. When I go on Apollo I'm out of my seat the whole drop, but when I'm on Nitro I don't really leave the seat at all.

 

I get way more air on Nitro's drop than on Apollo's Chariot's drop. The pre-drop does nothing for me. I prefer rides with the drop right off of the lift than rides with a pre-drop. Both rides do have GREAT first drops though, I just prefer Nitro's.

 

I can't wait to see how this ride turns out. Maybe in a few years I will get up there to experience that 85 degree drop!

[steel]

Actually, the view is fine from 4-across, it's the exact same from each seat. With this, the view will be obstructed a bit on the back/side seats.

 

Fewer riders per train

Longer load times

Partially obstructed views

 

 

 

So dumb.....

Willski, Bolliger and Mabillard are absolutely not idiots. They wouldn't allow these trains to get on the track if they were so obviously worse than their current design.

I'm not a huge fan of them either, but all you're doing is complaining.

Fewer riders per train? Yeah, four fewer. That's nothing.

Longer load times? Absolutely not. There's more than enough room to get in everywhere. If anything, this will reduce load times.

And obstructed views? I don't know what you're talking about here. First of all, the view is definitely not the same in every seat because you can't see much when you're in the middle of the back. Normal B&Ms aren't dive machines with stadium seating. Second, there will probably be a better view in the side seats on these than in the fronts.

[DRACHEN_FIRE_FAN-BOY]

you know... Im just gonna let willski's post be, becasue there are so many things wrong.... Willski... you just have no idea, do you? zero-g 9_9 you want slightly negative vertical g, to produce more air-time nurrr!

[Carnage]

you know... Im just gonna let willski's post be, becasue there are so many things wrong....

 

If you were going to leave it alone you just wouldn't have posted.

 

Instead of just telling him he was wrong without giving any reason what so ever.

 

At least he explained his opinion well.

[307]

At first I was looking forward to the buzz that this coaster would generate, but after 29 pages of arguing over the freakin' set-up of the trains, it's just bored me and may have actually dampened my excitement over the ride. Nitpicking is one thing but this is just getting out of hand.

 

That said, I work across the street from the park so it's going to be a lot of fun watching them construct MapleHawk right in front of my eyes! Hell, I even get paid for it!

[willski]

you know... Im just gonna let willski's post be, becasue there are so many things wrong.... Willski... you just have no idea, do you? zero-g 9_9 you want slightly negative vertical g, to produce more air-time nurrr!

 

 

Right....it's so wrong that you couldn't find the time to point out anything wrong with it? Haha, what a thought provoking and insightful post you've made! Thanks for contributing!

 

 

B&M's Megacoasters rarely (if ever) go far into the negative vertical g range. They tend to go for a parabolic hill that will produce exactly 0g (or at most -0.2 gs). It's just one facet of their overengineering of rides.

 

I am well aware of the fact that greater negative g's produce more of an "ejector" style of airtime. However, if you haven't ridden a B&M Megacoaster, I can tell you from personal experience that they do not have "ejector" airtime. They have a very precisely controlled and sustained "floater" style of airtime. Additionally, increasing negative vertical g's does nothing for the "amount" of airtime. That depends on a plethora of factors like hill shape, train speed, etc. Increasing negative vertical g's increases the "strength" of the airtime.

 

 

Also, on a slightly unrelated note, I would hesitate to believe that you are 20 years old. Of course, I have no way of knowing, but it seems to me that a 20 year old would be slightly more capable of forming and expressing coherent thoughts than that post demonstrates.

 

 

Willski, Bolliger and Mabillard are absolutely not idiots. They wouldn't allow these trains to get on the track if they were so obviously worse than their current design.

I'm not a huge fan of them either, but all you're doing is complaining.

Fewer riders per train? Yeah, four fewer. That's nothing.

Longer load times? Absolutely not. There's more than enough room to get in everywhere. If anything, this will reduce load times.

And obstructed views? I don't know what you're talking about here. First of all, the view is definitely not the same in every seat because you can't see much when you're in the middle of the back. Normal B&Ms aren't dive machines with stadium seating. Second, there will probably be a better view in the side seats on these than in the fronts.

 

I'll address your self Q&As one by one.

 

-Ahhh, you see, these trains are worse than their current design. Although it is only the equivalent of one car, each train does hold four fewer riders, lowering capacity slightly. It's not a huge deal, but when combined with the other factors, it will make a difference.

 

-Loading times will absolutely be increased for two reasons. First off, the train is longer (at the very least 1.5 to 1.75 times longer than the current trains) and has alternating "in" and "out" seats. This means it will take ride operators longer to check harnesses. Secondly, if the strange seating arrangement doesn't throw riders off (which it undoubtedly will, even if a small amount), it will present problems for riders with loose articles. Note that if the rider on the load side in the back row of each car crosses over to place loose articles on the loading dock and the rider on the unload side pulls down his/her restraints, it will be quite difficult for the loose article rider to get back to his/her seat.

 

-I was referring to the fact that in the front car, there will now only be two truly "front row" seats, and the seats in the second row of the front car will have their views obstructed slightly. In other rows it doesn't make much of a difference.

 

B&M are certainly not idiots, but this design does not seem entirely thought out.

[yankees15]

^Apollo's Chariot has some nice ejector air on the last hill. I mean it's not El toro ejector but it is definitely more than 0g.

[willski]

^Apollo's Chariot has some nice ejector air on the last hill. I mean it's not El toro ejector but it is definitely more than 0g.

 

And the rest of the hils on the entire ride? All at or around 0g. The airtime on that hill certainly isn't 0g, but the effect of the sudden drop adds to the effect that the airtime is strong ejector airtime.

[BeemerBoy]

Woah, I just realized this, there is a trim brake on every hill after the hammerhead turn, and before the MCBR, except the hill leading in to the MCBR, wow, thats gonna suck.

 

Woah, I just realized that the logo and the colors are almost exactly like Goliath.

 

Woah, those new trains are weird! They are like Deja Vu's trains. I don't know if I like them. What was B&M thinking?

 

Woah, those new trains are pretty cool! The seating is so different, like Deja Vu.

 

Woah, this ride will be an awesome addition to CW.

 

Woah, this ride is gonna suck, the layout looks boring.

Sorry, I just thought it was time for another recap of the past week's action in here.

 

EDIT: Oh yeah, and the ride has unofficially been renamed "MapleHawk."

[larrygator]

it will present problems for riders with loose articles. Note that if the rider on the load side in the back row of each car crosses over to place loose articles on the loading dock and the rider on the unload side pulls down his/her restraints, it will be quite difficult for the loose article rider to get back to his/her seat.

 

With 4 across seating if the person on the load side has loose items the same problems occurs, doesn't it. It sure seems to occur ever time I ride one.

 

Maybe these new trains will not lock the restraints until the unload platform is clear of those with loose articles.

[coasterfreak101]

I'm a little confused here. Maybe I missed something, but what's to say that they won't have seperate air gates for each row, like any other 4-person-per-car coaster?

 

Either way, I like the trains. They're a break from the ordinary, and with them CW has something that no other park has.

 

Everyone can start throwing in their "but!"s now.

[Tmcdllr]

Enough about the trains and trims please! This coaster is still in pieces. You cant really know for sure until you ride it.

[All Clear]

it will present problems for riders with loose articles. Note that if the rider on the load side in the back row of each car crosses over to place loose articles on the loading dock and the rider on the unload side pulls down his/her restraints, it will be quite difficult for the loose article rider to get back to his/her seat.

 

Unless they decide to enforce similar rules that lots of places are turning to, i.e., no bags allowed in the station and sit on your flip flops. This has helped capacity at BGE a LOT this year. And they enforce it well, too. I saw a girl today get denied her ride on Alpengeist (front row, no less) because she had a backpack with her. The ride op politely told her that it needed to be left in a locker or with a non-rider, which she instantly became.

[steel]

-Ahhh, you see, these trains are worse than their current design. Although it is only the equivalent of one car, each train does hold four fewer riders, lowering capacity slightly. It's not a huge deal, but when combined with the other factors, it will make a difference.

And how much of a difference can that make? It's still a huge people eater and will move faster than pretty much every other line in the park.

 

-Loading times will absolutely be increased for two reasons. First off, the train is longer (at the very least 1.5 to 1.75 times longer than the current trains) and has alternating "in" and "out" seats. This means it will take ride operators longer to check harnesses. Secondly, if the strange seating arrangement doesn't throw riders off (which it undoubtedly will, even if a small amount), it will present problems for riders with loose articles. Note that if the rider on the load side in the back row of each car crosses over to place loose articles on the loading dock and the rider on the unload side pulls down his/her restraints, it will be quite difficult for the loose article rider to get back to his/her seat.

Ops had to do exactly that with the normal trains. Now they don't have to step over anyone to get to the middle seats. Think. People will not be confused because there will pretty much have to be two separate air gates (yes, I know they don't do that on Deja Vu, but that's a Six Flags Vekoma and this is a Cedar Fair B&M). It's fairly obvious where the rows start and end. Again, you are mindlessly complaining about the loose articles issue. Please tell me how on earth this arrangement could possibly be any worse than the current one in the loose articles department? The load side seat now has to step over three other seats, compared to one now. It's like that on every coaster, not just this one.

 

-I was referring to the fact that in the front car, there will now only be two truly "front row" seats, and the seats in the second row of the front car will have their views obstructed slightly. In other rows it doesn't make much of a difference.

I still don't see how those two seats will be obstructed. There's nothing near them anywhere.

 

B&M are certainly not idiots, but this design does not seem entirely thought out.

Well of course, because this layout is a little shorter and the trains are a little different, it must not have been thought out. You are nitpicking. That's all you're doing. You still have not addressed any major faults in the design. This is huge for B&M. This is the first time since Air that they have done anything risky or new.

Someone said this earlier and they are totally, undeniably, completely correct:

Why is it that enthusiasts are happy to ride any Dragon Wagon at all of the most obscure parks in the middle of nowhere, but when a ride with real potential is announced, all they can do is complain?

Do you honestly think that you can't enjoy this ride because of trims that more than likely will not be used, trains that don't look familiar, or the fact that the capacity of the ride will be a tiny, tiny bit smaller? Please wake up, people.

[Carnage]

And how much of a difference can that make? It's still a huge people eater and will move faster than pretty much every other line in the park.

 

It'll easily be the highest capacity in the park.

 

Up until now Wonderland really didn't have any high capacity rides.

[thecoasterkid]

To me the fastest moving line in the park has always been Vortex, yet that will easily be eclipsed by Behemoth.

 

It will still be a people eater and should actually be easier to load and unload than your typical 4-across Beemer. The fact that it will be only the 2nd coaster in the park to use 3 trains is reason enough for it to push the crowds.

[Carnage]

The fact that it will be only the 2nd coaster in the park to use 3 trains is reason enough for it to push the crowds.

 

Doesn't really say much either, as Italian Job's three trains basically equal a single full size B&M train.

[Electerik]

Well, the trains do look kinda funky, but I like the layout, and hooray for the 85-degree first drop! Plus, it's always nice to see another hypercoaster. And a unique name, too! (Although, not really a good name, but I guess you can't have everything. )

 

 

Electerik

Snap Judgment Guru

[Tmcdllr]

Still picking apart the trains and trims? Why? Wait until you ride it then you can pick it apart all you want. To complain about this stuff now, still, while it is in pieces is foolish. As was said earlier how do you know the trims will even be used - you dont. How do you know the trains will be so bad - you dont. This is beyond stating opinions now and it has turned into whining and complaining. Lame.

[coaster05]

Still picking apart the trains and trims? Why? Wait until you ride it then you can pick it apart all you want. To complain about this stuff now, still, while it is in pieces is foolish. As was said earlier how do you know the trims will even be used - you dont. How do you know the trains will be so bad - you dont. This is beyond stating opinions now and it has turned into whining and complaining. Lame.

 

On this page one person made negative comments about the train, but you posted twice about people's complaints. So tell me which is worse?

[Tmcdllr]

Well then why has it continued and gone on this long?

[DerekRx]

^Because people like you keep posting to the thread! If you'd stop complaining about the complainers, maybe people would stop posting, as this thread would eventually leave page 1!

 

A page holds like 10 posts, in the last page, 2 of those 10 were from you, about the same thing. So 1/5 of the senselessness this thread has become in the last page is because of you. People see 31 pages of a discussion and think it's a hot topic, when in reality it's the same 7 things over and over again. The trains look dumb, the drop looks cool, the name is stupid, the trims could suck, the layout is ____, this will be the best ride in the park, and shut up until you ride.

 

It's not rocket science, if you would just let it die, eventually it would. Instead you continue saying the same thing over and over again, making the thread longer, and bringing more people back to see what all the discussion is about, who then voice their opinion, which is exactly the same from what everyone else has said previously. It really shouldn't matter to you if people think it could be trimmed, we're all not as positive and humorless as you, Dee Dee Dee! And everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you don't have to try to jam yours down their throats to stop posting.

[Tmcdllr]

Whatever. This is pointless. You contributed to it too. I did not start this whole thing. I am done.

[BeemerBoy]

I am done.

Now you're getting the hang of it.