Cedar Point (CP) Discussion Thread

[TB305]

It was speculated that the reason for the 15 million price tag was that Normal track was being used like on krake.

Griffon cost 15.6M, this coaster will definitely be of similar size. Isn't the price from the Sandusky

Register excluding excavation, construction cost? I believe that Griffon's reported price tag is the final price (the actual coaster but also construction, land moving). If that is correct, CP's dive machine will definitely be larger than Griffon.

 

Also to all the naysayers about dive machines: I live close to BGW, and Griffon is absolutely awesome; it has a great mix of airtime and positive G's. Also, it is without a doubt the smoothest coaster I've ever been on.

 

after Griffons drop it is completely boring. any enthusiast would know that

"Any enthusiast" would know not to judge a roller coaster before they ride it, because often times a coaster will surprise you even if it doesn't look intimidating. I've been on it over 100 times and I never get bored of it. I'm sure you know all though, and your opinion is fact, so I've been defeated. A crushing loss, truly.

[I305isadrug]

It was speculated that the reason for the 15 million price tag was that Normal track was being used like on krake.

Griffon cost 15.6M, this coaster will definitely be of similar size. Isn't the price from the Sandusky

Register excluding excavation, construction cost? I believe that Griffon's reported price tag is the final price (the actual coaster but also construction, land moving). If that is correct, CP's dive machine will definitely be larger than Griffon.

 

Also to all the naysayers about dive machines: I live close to BGW, and Griffon is absolutely awesome; it has a great mix of airtime and positive G's. Also, it is without a doubt the smoothest coaster I've ever been on.

 

after Griffons drop it is completely boring. any enthusiast would know that

"Any enthusiast" would know not to judge a roller coaster before they ride it, because often times a coaster will surprise you even if it doesn't look intimidating. I've been on it over 100 times and I never get bored of it. I'm sure you know all though, and your opinion is fact, so I've been defeated. A crushing loss, truly.

 

i work at bgw and know firsthand about griffon, great first drop, boring after, simple as that, move on

[TB305]

It was speculated that the reason for the 15 million price tag was that Normal track was being used like on krake.

Griffon cost 15.6M, this coaster will definitely be of similar size. Isn't the price from the Sandusky

Register excluding excavation, construction cost? I believe that Griffon's reported price tag is the final price (the actual coaster but also construction, land moving). If that is correct, CP's dive machine will definitely be larger than Griffon.

 

Also to all the naysayers about dive machines: I live close to BGW, and Griffon is absolutely awesome; it has a great mix of airtime and positive G's. Also, it is without a doubt the smoothest coaster I've ever been on.

 

after Griffons drop it is completely boring. any enthusiast would know that

"Any enthusiast" would know not to judge a roller coaster before they ride it, because often times a coaster will surprise you even if it doesn't look intimidating. I've been on it over 100 times and I never get bored of it. I'm sure you know all though, and your opinion is fact, so I've been defeated. A crushing loss, truly.

 

i work at bgw and know firsthand about griffon, great first drop, boring after, simple as that, move on

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/opinion

[SbSteveZ]

Rougie and Valravn

 

now they ONLY have Rougie left... .

 

Really, guys? Would it kill you to type two more letters?

 

 

Sorry, I only called it that because other people seemed to be doing the same - I've also seen Millie but I personally dont like that alteration of the awesomeness that is the Millennium Force. Only Rougarou from now on, I promise.

[TunaSled]

i work at bgw and know firsthand about griffon, great first drop, boring after, simple as that, move on

I don't work there. Guess what, I still know about it firsthand! Also I know where my shift key is.

[coasterbill]

Also I know where my shift key is.

 

You just won the internet.

 

[DoinItForTheFame]

In my view, (a) the two tracks have very different spine proportions, and (b) one photo with similar spine heights does rule out a dive machine

 

In the quoted picture, the frame spine height is about 3.5x the rail diameter. In the picture directly above, that height is about 5x the rail diameter. Since the rail diameter is a constant, this implies the spine is much thicker in some areas of the ride than in others. Wing rider coasters have generally had more consistent spine thicknesses

 

Incidentally, the spine height of Baron 1898 appears to vary from about 5x rail diameter to about 3.5x rail diameter, with the thicker rail at the first drop.

 

Okay, this makes no sense to me. (Or maybe I am just reading it wrong.)

 

You are trying to rule out this being a Dive Machine by saying "the frame spine height is about 3.5x the rail diameter. In the picture directly above, that height is about 5x the rail diameter." ... But you then compare this to a Dive Machine that "appears to vary from about 5x rail diameter to about 3.5x rail diameter?"

 

Do we think that MAYBE B&M knows what they are doing when it comes to fabricating track, and maybe there is a reason the spine is not the same size throughout the track? Maybe the spine is thickest at the bottom of the drops where g-forces are highest, and the spine is thinner in places the g-forces are lower? ... I mean... that makes sense to me, and that is clearly what they did on Baron 1898.

 

 

i work at bgw and know firsthand about griffon, great first drop, boring after, simple as that, move on

 

If you work at Busch Gardens Williamsburg then you would know you should never talk poorly about attractions in your place of employment. A park employee complaining about attractions in their park, GOOD attractions at that, really does not sit well among coaster enthusiast... or anyone for that matter.

 

I mean I guess I can see why you would think Griffon is boring after its first drop. I mean Immelmann's are so boring. B&M should just stop putting them on their coasters. Clearly no one likes them... And, UGH!!! What were they thinking having the drop off the MCBR be 130 ft at 90 degrees so boring. Followed by another Immelmann?? Ugh, what a waste of time. You know... now that I think of it, they should probably just tear it down and put in a Vekoma SLC... I mean that would obviously be a much better, more thrilling, less boring ride.

 

If Dive Machines are such awful coasters... Why do people LOVE them??? I will never for the life of me understand why so many people dislike dive machines so much. Sure Griffon and SheiKra have pretty "simple" layouts, but that was when B&M was first really getting going with the Dive Machines. Dive machines are starting to feature more elements like zero g rolls, and corkscrews. There is no telling what B&M and Cedar Point have come up with for this Dive Machine.

 

Also, as for the whole $15 million debate...Griffon cost $15,600,000 in 2006 that would be about $18,401,577.38 today. So either Cedar Point is getting a Dive Machine that is much smaller than Griffon, or the $15 million price that is being rumored is wrong?

 

As I feel like I have had to say 15 million times in this thread Cedar Point is not going to go out and build a Dive Machine, or ANY roller coaster for that fact that is not going to thrill, and WOW their guest. (Aside from Pipescream, even though we all know that is not really a roller coaster.) I personally do not "boring" "force-less" Dive Machine coming to Cedar Point. I will say, as I have said before. Anyone who has actually ridden SheiKra, or Griffon, or both will know that they are not boring force-less rides. They drops are amazing. The holding brake at the top does just what it is suppose to do. It scares the SH!T out of you as you hang there waiting to drop. As your entire body weight is put onto the harness as you hang there you get one of those true "Restraint don't fail me now" moments. After a great first drop you are thrown into high positive g's followed by an inversion, more high g's and another almost vertical (or vertical drop depending on the coaster.) Not to mention all of the coasters is incredibly smooth. NOTHING about that screams boring to me.

 

I feel like Cedar Point pushed the envelope for so many years with Magnum, MF, TTD, and Maverick that everyone got use to record breaking scream machines... and now that they are simply adding a GOOD new coaster everyone is disappointed because it is not a world record breaking 1,500ft coaster with a 0-500mph launch in 1 second. If Kings Island were to get a Dive Machine everyone would be super excited, and talking about what a great addition to the park it is. . . Yet Cedar Point is getting one and no one has anything positive to say about it.

 

Well I will be more than happy to ride the new Dive Machine, and I will not get off complaining about how force-less it was, or how boring it was, or how it could have been 5,000ft taller, or 200mph faster, or how I hate the way the colors look because "OH MY GOD CEDAR POINT IS GETTING ANOTHER RED/ORANGE COASTER?! WTF?!?!" I will get off being glad that there is another great coaster at Cedar Point. But I guess I am in a minority on this.

 

#EndRant

 

i work at bgw and know firsthand about griffon, great first drop, boring after, simple as that, move on

I don't work there. Guess what, I still know about it firsthand! Also I know where my shift key is.

This made my day!

Glad to know I am not the only one who does not have to work at a park to know about a coaster firsthand.

Edited July 15, 2015 by DoinItForTheFame

[DrachenfireOP]

All modern coasters have a varying spine size. Also, many have cross tie placements that vary based on the portion of the ride. High G means thicker spine, closer cross ties. I'm 90% positive this is dive machine track. It's just way too large not to be. The picture with the truck gives it away. Also, even in the picture sitting next to the red track, if you look at it properly, you'll notice they appear the same size only because of a perspective illusion. They're not the same thickness at all.

 

While it's a little hard to tell with the supports in the way, you can see the difference in these pieces of Griffon track (that was totally taken where someone shouldn't have been taking pictures, but meh, not my picture and they've chosen to host it online).

 

 

Just for giggles, you can really see the difference in cross tie placement on old Arrow coasters. It was a lot more drastic back then. Notice the difference between the bottom and top of the loop!

 

 

B&M seems to vary that less, and opt for slightly thicker and thinner spines. Intimin is the most noticeable based on how many spines they have on the various sections!

[Intimidator305]

Not the biggest B&M fan, but the dive machines are their greatest rides they've created in the past decade. In fact, Griffon is my favorite coaster at BGW and Sheikra is my second favorite coaster at BGT.

 

Yes, a dive machine wouldn't be the best ride at Cedar Point no matter how spectacular it is, but I feel like it could very well be the best B&M at the park. This is the only type of B&M I would want to see Cedar Point install to go with their current collection of B&Ms.

[Coaster Hero]

I can see now how that enormous piece of track in the first picture could be for a high-g section. The crosstie spacing is weird on some of the pieces too.

[DoinItForTheFame]

Not the biggest B&M fan, but the dive machines are their greatest rides they've created in the past decade. In fact, Griffon is my favorite coaster at BGW and Sheikra is my second favorite coaster at BGT.

 

Yes, a dive machine wouldn't be the best ride at Cedar Point no matter how spectacular it is, but I feel like it could very well be the best B&M at the park. This is the only type of B&M I would want to see Cedar Point install to go with their current collection of B&Ms.

 

THANK YOU! Finally someone who gets it!

[canadianparkfan]

^^^Longest rant on the site?

 

Anyway, would personally be pretty surprised if CP got a dive machine. For some reason it feels outa place there. Personally think a dark ride or RMC of mean streak would fit much better.

 

Then again, what do I know?... Never been there; simply going off my basic knowledge of the park.

 

Just my two cents.

[DrachenfireOP]

I mean, I'm not really a fan of dive machines. Griffon isn't a bad ride, but it's number 5 for me at BGW personally. To each is own. If CP is getting a dive, I would hope it's a rock solid, long, cool layout with a zero G roll. That would rock!

 

I try not to take other people's opions too strongly. People ragged on gatekeeper and firehawk, but I liked both. I also like Arrows and stand ups. I find Griffon a bit too smooth and short, but again, to each is own.

 

One things for sure, the people saying whatever CP puts in, it will be spectacular, I agree with. CP isn't a half ass kind of park. It will be good, whatever it is.

 

Imagine a forceful, long, intense dive machine with the new age B&M restraints, duel loading stations, and the CP style effecient crews! That'll be a slam dunk for the park.

[TunaSled]

Big shout out to Rebecca, last dispatcher on Maverick yesterday (Monday). She was hilarious, in a great mood, and completely made our evening with our two night rides on Mav before leaving the park. She was clearly having fun doing her job and it made the atmosphere in the station incredible. Thanks Rebecca! If any Maverick crew is reading, let her know she's awesome.

[DonkeysWaffles]

There were two types of track there: one gray-ish brown and one orange-ish red. I know that the latter is NOT dive track, more like either invert or wing track, and the former has the marking of dive track but the tie is cut instead of straight like dive track. My guess is that the new dive coaster will be have lower trains and the former is going to CP. The latter is a tossup between Great Adventure, Kings Dominion, and Canada's Wonderland.

[Gutterflower]

There were two types of track there: one gray-ish brown and one orange-ish red. I know that the latter is NOT dive track, more like either invert or wing track, and the former has the marking of dive track but the tie is cut instead of straight like dive track. My guess is that the new dive coaster will be have lower trains and the former is going to CP. The latter is a tossup between Great Adventure, Kings Dominion, and Canada's Wonderland.

 

The red track is wing coaster track for Hotgo park in China I'm afraid.

 

[DonkeysWaffles]

There were two types of track there: one gray-ish brown and one orange-ish red. I know that the latter is NOT dive track, more like either invert or wing track, and the former has the marking of dive track but the tie is cut instead of straight like dive track. My guess is that the new dive coaster will be have lower trains and the former is going to CP. The latter is a tossup between Great Adventure, Kings Dominion, and Canada's Wonderland.

 

The red track is wing coaster track for Hotgo park in China I'm afraid.

 

 

Then that leaves the other track. I'm actually not sure if that's dive track. It could be winged because of the cut in the tie. It also makes sense because Cedar Point would probably be getting purple track for Valravn.

[ElectricUncleSam]

It was speculated that the reason for the 15 million price tag was that Normal track was being used like on krake.

Griffon cost 15.6M, this coaster will definitely be of similar size. Isn't the price from the Sandusky

Register excluding excavation, construction cost? I believe that Griffon's reported price tag is the final price (the actual coaster but also construction, land moving). If that is correct, CP's dive machine will definitely be larger than Griffon.

 

Also to all the naysayers about dive machines: I live close to BGW, and Griffon is absolutely awesome; it has a great mix of airtime and positive G's. Also, it is without a doubt the smoothest coaster I've ever been on.

 

after Griffons drop it is completely boring. any enthusiast would know that

I hate people like you that claim there's only one type of enthusiast. You think that all enthusiasts have to agree or somebody's not an enthusiast. Seriously, if he loves the ride, let him love it. Just because he loves it doesn't mean he's not an enthusiast. I love Gatekeeper and The Beast, am I notan enthusiast?

[kcurry11]

With this ride, whatever it turns out to be, will be good for CP. $15M or not, it will be great. I'm done speculating, and am just going to wait and see, because honestly, I think it will make it better that way.

[kcurry11]

With this ride, whatever it turns out to be, will be good for CP. $15M or not, it will be great. I'm done speculating. I am honestly just going to wait and see, because I think it will make it better that way.

[Superbatboy]

It was speculated that the reason for the 15 million price tag was that Normal track was being used like on krake.

Griffon cost 15.6M, this coaster will definitely be of similar size. Isn't the price from the Sandusky

Register excluding excavation, construction cost? I believe that Griffon's reported price tag is the final price (the actual coaster but also construction, land moving). If that is correct, CP's dive machine will definitely be larger than Griffon.

 

Also to all the naysayers about dive machines: I live close to BGW, and Griffon is absolutely awesome; it has a great mix of airtime and positive G's. Also, it is without a doubt the smoothest coaster I've ever been on.

 

after Griffons drop it is completely boring. any enthusiast would know that

I hate people like you that claim there's only one type of enthusiast. You think that all enthusiasts have to agree or somebody's not an enthusiast. Seriously, if he loves the ride, let him love it. Just because he loves it doesn't mean he's not an enthusiast. I love Gatekeeper and The Beast, am I notan enthusiast?

Touché?

[Hilltopper39]

Wasn't there a rumor a few years back about B&M developing a flying coaster style dive machine? I love Sheikra and think it's an awesome coaster that would be a nice addition to most any park but Cedar Point already has 3 rides with verticalish drops over 200 feet, not sure how much this would stand out in their collection.

 

A flying Dive Machine would be pretty awesome, and really crazy addition to that park.

[DILinator]

Wasn't there a rumor a few years back about B&M developing a flying coaster style dive machine? I love Sheikra and think it's an awesome coaster that would be a nice addition to most any park but Cedar Point already has 3 rides with verticalish drops over 200 feet, not sure how much this would stand out in their collection.

 

A flying Dive Machine would be pretty awesome, and really crazy addition to that park.

 

I've never heard of such a thing, but I can assure you: if they made one, I'd be first in line to right it!

[Brassinthegrass]

I think it's safe to say that there will be more than one B&M being built next year... It's possible that the cedar point track hasn't even been built yet!

[Password121]

I think it's safe to say that there will be more than one B&M being built next year... It's possible that the cedar point track hasn't even been built yet!

Do you mean specifically for a Cedar Fair park? There have already been multiple announced 2016 B&M coasters.