Cedar Point (CP) Discussion Thread

[GigaG]

So, apparently, Iron Dragon has only been running 2 trains. This isn't the sad part. The sad part is why, according to PointBuzz-

 

The rumor is that the 3rd train has been ditched because too many guests complained that they felt hurried when loading onto the ride.

from user Lowkae.

 

Somebody said (obviously sarcastically) that they can't wait that until this happens to Magnum. My response - that would make me a saaaaad panda.

[cmullin]

^ That's sad, I thought that people would want to get on a coaster ASAP, so they can get on more rides, I'm surprised.

[BigDipper 80]

^^ I'm not terribly surprised by that sentiment. I worked at ID a few times last summer and it's damn near impossible for the average guest to figure out how to sit down and pull down the restraint in the 30 seconds that ride has for its interval. So many of them were confused that they had to take their bags with them and whatnot. It's unfortunate that people-eaters like Arrows can actually be considered "too efficient" for guests these days.

[Koasterking48]

So I have a question, i will be going to halloweekends either the 1st or the 4th week if october and I was just wondering if it woukd be better to go on a friday and saturday with fast lane or a friday and sunday. I know saturdays are crazy so any help would be great.

Avoid Saturdays at all costs. I made the mistake of visiting on a Saturday in Halloweekends and it was packed (Quite a few years before Fast Lane). I'd still take Friday and Sunday with FL+ on at least one of those days if that's an financial option for you.

[Philrad71]

^Agreed.

 

I have never been to Halloweekends on a Saturday when it hasn't had close to a full parking lot & full queues on most of the major coasters. I would definitely recommend springing for the FL or skip the park altogether on that day.

 

I have had lots of luck visiting on Friday nights with light lines (with the exception of the haunts) & Sunday's are usually pretty dead too.

[GayCoasterGuy]

So, apparently, Iron Dragon has only been running 2 trains. This isn't the sad part. The sad part is why, according to PointBuzz-

 

The rumor is that the 3rd train has been ditched because too many guests complained that they felt hurried when loading onto the ride.

from user Lowkae.

 

Somebody said (obviously sarcastically) that they can't wait that until this happens to Magnum. My response - that would make me a saaaaad panda.

 

Ahhh... brings me back to the days I worked on a manual Blue Streak. The bell would ring and the train had to go, "one way or another." It was like a circus sometimes .... "MY SEAT BELT - MY SEAT BELT" some would yell as the train was rolling out of the station; sometimes with us riding the running boards to fasten seat belts (and then jump off at the base of the lift).

 

People were "tougher" back then, and less complain-y about being rushed... there were no queue gates in the park, and people were generally better behaved, and took more responsibility for themselves.

 

It was in the "transition years" where doing old school stuff (like riding the running boards to cram down bars or fasten seatbelts - AND - announcing "the seat belts are optional, you do not have to use them") was slowly becoming a no-no and stricter operational rules started applying. Operational "grey areas" eventually became black and white/yes and no. I'm grateful to have experienced that, good times. In the following years, people started complaining about seat belts and being rushed... goodbye manual operation

[Koasterking48]

^ Long story short, people became more ignorant and now we have said people complaining about EVERYTHING.

Edited August 17, 2013 by Koasterking48

[GayCoasterGuy]

^I'll have to agree with that. It seems an extension of the "America is sue happy" and entitlement thing. I hope it's just a cycle; that we will get back to being able to pay attention and be aware of what's going on around us... people seem so dummed-down.

[coasterlover420]

^ Long story short, people became more ignorant and now we have said people complaining about EVERYTHING.

This describes working at CP exactly. I wish I could have worked back in the day GCG is describing!

[GayCoasterGuy]

^It's a blessing AND a curse. A curse because it's very difficult to not get frustrated when you watch park operations (at many parks) now. All the empty seats, the stacking trains, the song and dance "take 5" before a train can go. The COMPLETE stop before a train can come down the final brakes... it all seems so ridiculous.

[GigaG]

^I'll have to agree with that. It seems an extension of the "America is sue happy" and entitlement thing. I hope it's just a cycle; that we will get back to being able to pay attention and be aware of what's going on around us... people seem so dummed-down.

 

What I'm angry about is that now we can't have buzz bars, Mega-Lites, and even THREE TRAIN OPERATION because of either the GP being idiots/loop fanatics or the parks fearing lawsuits.

 

^It's a blessing AND a curse. A curse because it's very difficult to not get frustrated when you watch park operations (at many parks) now. All the empty seats, the stacking trains, the song and dance "take 5" before a train can go. The COMPLETE stop before a train can come down the final brakes... it all seems so ridiculous.

 

About the complete stop - What is it for? Michigan Adventure runs an Arrow Corkscrew with 1 train (can those even run 2 trains) and it completely stops before coming in.

[Tmcdllr]

So, apparently, Iron Dragon has only been running 2 trains. This isn't the sad part. The sad part is why, according to PointBuzz-

 

The rumor is that the 3rd train has been ditched because too many guests complained that they felt hurried when loading onto the ride.

from user Lowkae.

 

Somebody said (obviously sarcastically) that they can't wait that until this happens to Magnum. My response - that would make me a saaaaad panda.

 

Complained because they felt hurried loading? Either that is complete crap and CP doesn't really want to say why they ditched the 3rd train, or people are just really stupid and bitchy and would rather wait in line longer (so they could complain about that too) than get on the ride quicker. And if they were forcing guests to load "too quickly" why then didn't they just change the procedure a little instead of getting rid of a train? That just sounds really dumb for some reason.

 

[GayCoasterGuy]

What I'm angry about is that now we can't have buzz bars, Mega-Lites, and even THREE TRAIN OPERATION because of either the GP being idiots/loop fanatics or the parks fearing lawsuits.

 

We can have buzz bars... they are just unfortunately rare now.

 

I'd rather see news headlines "man arrested and facing charges for standing up on roller coaster" than "Kings Island Beast strands 30+ riders (during a random and typical lift shutdown.)" If parks cracked down on people misbehaving, that would be good.

 

About the complete stop - What is it for? Michigan Adventure runs an Arrow Corkscrew with 1 train (can those even run 2 trains) and it completely stops before coming in.

 

It's been a long time since I operated a coaster, but I'm going to assume it has to do with making sure the track is clear (and needing that "clear" ride op signal) for the train being allowed to come in. It's a back-up to an Emergency stop button. Imagine if the subways were run that way.

[GigaG]

What I'm angry about is that now we can't have buzz bars, Mega-Lites, and even THREE TRAIN OPERATION because of either the GP being idiots/loop fanatics or the parks fearing lawsuits.

 

We can have buzz bars... they are just unfortunately rare now.

 

I'd rather see news headlines "man arrested and facing charges for standing up on roller coaster" than "Kings Island Beast strands 30+ riders (during a random and typical lift shutdown.)" If parks cracked down on people misbehaving, that would be good.

 

About the complete stop - What is it for? Michigan Adventure runs an Arrow Corkscrew with 1 train (can those even run 2 trains) and it completely stops before coming in.

 

It's been a long time since I operated a coaster, but I'm going to assume it has to do with making sure the track is clear (and needing that "clear" ride op signal) for the train being allowed to come in. It's a back-up to an Emergency stop button. Imagine if the subways were run that way.

 

The lift shut down reminds me of a news story around the time of the Darien Lake Ride of Steel ejection, where they said "two incidents have happened recently on roller coasters." The second incident? NTAG stopping on the lift and having to be evacuated.

 

Honestly, although there are a lot of clears, I do think it is kind of unsafe to fasten restraints as the train dispatches and saying seatbelts are optional. Honestly, I couldn't imagine a woodie with relatively small buzz bars and no seatbelts. Maybe PTC restraints and no belts, but a buzz bar?

By the way, is this sue-happiness why all coasters seem to have staple-a-thon individual restraints instead of loose individual restraints a la Mindbender at SFOG or buzz bars?

[GayCoasterGuy]

Honestly, although there are a lot of clears, I do think it is kind of unsafe to fasten restraints as the train dispatches and saying seatbelts are optional. Honestly, I couldn't imagine a woodie with relatively small buzz bars and no seatbelts. Maybe PTC restraints and no belts, but a buzz bar?

 

Nahh.. they are just fine. Seatbelts weren't standard PTC equipment until the last 20 years or so. They were very rare... I think Texas Cyclone had them - but only in the back car, and not until 1979. American Eagle may have had them put in after the first year or two... Colossus had them with the PTCs.

 

The Kings Island/Dominion, Carowinds parks didn't have seatbelts until in the 90s I believe. They all had one buzz bar (or "drop bar" as we used to call them.)

 

Seatbelts are only for kids on Kennywood's Exterminator. The last time I rode it, they were yelling "DON'T fasten the seat belts!"

 

With the seatbelts on Blue Streak, the park settled on the rule "if the restraint is ON the ride, it MUST be used." We were trained to tell people they were optional as a means to get the trains out with out a shutdown - it was all manual, no luxury of letting a train pause in the brakes. You didn't need the seatbelts to hold you in, they were redundant. If we got a train out late, we risked a shutdown, and that was VERY looked down upon back then. Again, this is all past-operating procedures.

 

I've heard they run things quick in Germany... specifically Olympia Looping.

 

Another big difference between now and then is that we were trained well. Perhaps that wording isn't the best; the level of responsibility we had was much higher than crews are trained to have these days. It was a job where you had to know what was going on everywhere in the station at all times, and had to be able to communicate very clearly with the other 2 guys working the ride. All spiels were manual... we could do 1,250 pph no problem.

[GigaG]

Honestly, although there are a lot of clears, I do think it is kind of unsafe to fasten restraints as the train dispatches and saying seatbelts are optional. Honestly, I couldn't imagine a woodie with relatively small buzz bars and no seatbelts. Maybe PTC restraints and no belts, but a buzz bar?

 

Nahh.. they are just fine. Seatbelts weren't standard PTC equipment until the last 20 years or so. They were very rare... I think Texas Cyclone had them - but only in the back car, and not until 1979. American Eagle may have had them put in after the first year or two... Colossus had them with the PTCs.

 

The Kings Island/Dominion, Carowinds parks didn't have seatbelts until in the 90s I believe. They all had one buzz bar (or "drop bar" as we used to call them.)

 

Seatbelts are only for kids on Kennywood's Exterminator. The last time I rode it, they were yelling "DON'T fasten the seat belts!"

 

With the seatbelts on Blue Streak, the park settled on the rule "if the restraint is ON the ride, it MUST be used." We were trained to tell people they were optional as a means to get the trains out with out a shutdown - it was all manual, no luxury of letting a train pause in the brakes. You didn't need the seatbelts to hold you in, they were redundant. If we got a train out late, we risked a shutdown, and that was VERY looked down upon back then. Again, this is all past-operating procedures.

 

I've heard they run things quick in Germany... specifically Olympia Looping.

 

Another big difference between now and then is that we were trained well. Perhaps that wording isn't the best; the level of responsibility we had was much higher than crews are trained to have these days. It was a job where you had to know what was going on everywhere in the station at all times, and had to be able to communicate very clearly with the other 2 guys working the ride. All spiels were manual... we could do 1,250 pph no problem.

 

It's crazy that equipment that was perfectly safe in 1964 seems dangerous in 2013. The ride hasn't gotten faster, hasn't changed much aside from repainting and retracking, and yet they feel the need to butcher classic woodies. Didn't PTC show buzz bar trains at IAPPA recently?

[coasterlover420]

As far as I know, running 2 trains on Iron Dragon was a company decision because of how fast employees had to move in order to check seats. You'd practically see employees running down the station trying to dispatch in time. The problem was that if the trains stacked, the third one would be on the second lift, and the way the ride is designed, an employee would have to go up to the second lift to restart it. Magnum used to be exactly the same, except now the release button is in the control booth instead of up on the block.

 

And as far as complaints from guests about being hurried...that's not Iron Dragon, that's Raptor.

 

^It's a blessing AND a curse. A curse because it's very difficult to not get frustrated when you watch park operations (at many parks) now. All the empty seats, the stacking trains, the song and dance "take 5" before a train can go. The COMPLETE stop before a train can come down the final brakes... it all seems so ridiculous.

I agree. Even after working at CP these past years, I feel spoiled when going to other parks because they only run two trains or because they stack trains so often.

[cmullin]

So, apparently, Iron Dragon has only been running 2 trains. This isn't the sad part. The sad part is why, according to PointBuzz-

 

The rumor is that the 3rd train has been ditched because too many guests complained that they felt hurried when loading onto the ride.

from user Lowkae.

 

Somebody said (obviously sarcastically) that they can't wait that until this happens to Magnum. My response - that would make me a saaaaad panda.

 

Ahhh... brings me back to the days I worked on a manual Blue Streak. The bell would ring and the train had to go, "one way or another." It was like a circus sometimes .... "MY SEAT BELT - MY SEAT BELT" some would yell as the train was rolling out of the station; sometimes with us riding the running boards to fasten seat belts (and then jump off at the base of the lift).

 

People were "tougher" back then, and less complain-y about being rushed... there were no queue gates in the park, and people were generally better behaved, and took more responsibility for themselves.

 

It was in the "transition years" where doing old school stuff (like riding the running boards to cram down bars or fasten seatbelts - AND - announcing "the seat belts are optional, you do not have to use them") was slowly becoming a no-no and stricter operational rules started applying. Operational "grey areas" eventually became black and white/yes and no. I'm grateful to have experienced that, good times. In the following years, people started complaining about seat belts and being rushed... goodbye manual operation

Seems crazy to think that you weren't required to wear a seatbelt on the coasters, if that happened these days, all hell would break loose.

[Vonni]

So, apparently, Iron Dragon has only been running 2 trains. This isn't the sad part. The sad part is why, according to PointBuzz-

 

The rumor is that the 3rd train has been ditched because too many guests complained that they felt hurried when loading onto the ride.

from user Lowkae.

 

Somebody said (obviously sarcastically) that they can't wait that until this happens to Magnum. My response - that would make me a saaaaad panda.

 

Ahhh... brings me back to the days I worked on a manual Blue Streak. The bell would ring and the train had to go, "one way or another." It was like a circus sometimes .... "MY SEAT BELT - MY SEAT BELT" some would yell as the train was rolling out of the station; sometimes with us riding the running boards to fasten seat belts (and then jump off at the base of the lift).

 

People were "tougher" back then, and less complain-y about being rushed... there were no queue gates in the park, and people were generally better behaved, and took more responsibility for themselves.

 

It was in the "transition years" where doing old school stuff (like riding the running boards to cram down bars or fasten seatbelts - AND - announcing "the seat belts are optional, you do not have to use them") was slowly becoming a no-no and stricter operational rules started applying. Operational "grey areas" eventually became black and white/yes and no. I'm grateful to have experienced that, good times. In the following years, people started complaining about seat belts and being rushed... goodbye manual operation

Seems crazy to think that you weren't required to wear a seatbelt on the coasters, if that happened these days, all hell would break loose.

 

Right! It would hit national news and then the GP would post comments to videos on Youtube saying "The Roller Coaster made him take it off! That orange haired witness on crack said so! Tear it down! Its not safe!". Lol! Its so sad that that is not far fetched!

[TopThrill182]

Does anyone else feel like the Plinko front of the line crap is getting ridiculous at the Point? When I visited the park last Saturday, August 10th, it seemed like an absurd number of people were playing AND winning the game (the four pack more often than not, too).

 

As a standby guest, yielding to an unending stream of FL users is already painful enough. But now, standby guests have to yield to Plinko winners, too--of which, on a crowded day, there are an abundance.

 

In the station for TTD Saturday evening, every other train was arriving to the station already half filled with exit pass people. That reduces the already reduced capacity for standby guests considerably.

 

It stinks that CP seems so willing to sell my spot in line to anyone with cash. /rant

 

(PS, I'm aware this game has been around since the beginning of the season, but I've noticed a much more pronounced effect from it during my most recent visits.)

[Vonni]

^ I think the spinning wheel game at KI and CGA are a better idea. There are discounts on food and merchandise, along with the front of the line pass. I think it reduces the amount of people taking the spots of people in line.

[cmullin]

^ I agree, when I was at KI they had, and probably still do, a big win you could spin with all sorts of prizes, like discounts on food and merchandise, but there was only one slot for front of the line pass. I probably watched for 5 minutes or so, and no one won a front of the line pass.

[SbSteveZ]

Ok, this is both off-topic and on-topic at the same time. off topic because its not about prices at the park or airfare or whatever but its on topic because its about Cedar Point sooo Looking at the records of coaster additions i saw some fun little things to point out. (None of which include coasters that were removed prior to the removal of Disaster Transport and Wildcat. the coasters they currently have go from Blue Streak in 1964 to CCMR in 1969 which was only 5 years apart. followed by Wildcat which was the very next season. then Corkscrew 6 years later followed by Gemini 2 years afterwards. already we can note that they don't have much of a pattern. 5, 1, 6, 2, and then Jr Gemini the next season (5,1,6,2,1) next in 1985 we have Avalanche Run 6 years later. then in 1989, 4 years later, we get a record Breaker Magnum XL 200. I don't personally count a retheming an "addition" but for the sake of numbers Avalanche run re-themed to disaster transport in 1990, followed by the addition of Mean Streak in 1991 (5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2) then 3 years later we get Raptor, followed by mantis 2 years afterwards, and 3 years after that we get woodstock express. (5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2,3,2,3) 1 season passes by and Millennium Force comes in with the new Record! 2 years later we get The Wicked Twister IMMEDIATELY followed by Dragster which is left as the newest addition up until 2007 (4 years later) with Maverick. Currently we stand at 5 years with Gatekeeper making the tally of the years in between: 5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2,3,2,3,1,2,1,4,5 I know there isn't much in the means of patterns here. Its like looking at 16 digits of pi. But it does show some potential for the park. Like when we got the 2 major Coasters a year apart from each other in 2002-03 or when the same happened in 1969-70 when we received 2 more family-oriented rides. I personally like the 1978-79 Gemini and Jr Gemini additions making a pair of coasters that go together. And to top it off 1999-2000 additions once again of a Jr coaster and a Big boy ride. Maybe its just my speculation but how cool would it be if the park added just one more kiddie coaster? in the front with Gatekeeper. "lil Griffon" "GateKeeper jr"? if the new 2014 ride / attraction is family oriented this could just as well be a possibility. But remember this is just my thoughts being shared with the community, not me spreading rumors. I'd just find it cool if we got an inverted kiddie coaster... (p.s. if the numbers up top confused you or made your brain hurt at all, I'm sorry, it was all in the 'Thinking out loud' process... )

[djcoastermark]

OOh K, now I feel as if I just had a vekoma slc moment ! thanks for that

[christianscoasters]

Ok, this is both off-topic and on-topic at the same time. off topic because its not about prices at the park or airfare or whatever but its on topic because its about Cedar Point sooo Looking at the records of coaster additions i saw some fun little things to point out. (None of which include coasters that were removed prior to the removal of Disaster Transport and Wildcat. the coasters they currently have go from Blue Streak in 1964 to CCMR in 1969 which was only 5 years apart. followed by Wildcat which was the very next season. then Corkscrew 6 years later followed by Gemini 2 years afterwards. already we can note that they don't have much of a pattern. 5, 1, 6, 2, and then Jr Gemini the next season (5,1,6,2,1) next in 1985 we have Avalanche Run 6 years later. then in 1989, 4 years later, we get a record Breaker Magnum XL 200. I don't personally count a retheming an "addition" but for the sake of numbers Avalanche run re-themed to disaster transport in 1990, followed by the addition of Mean Streak in 1991 (5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2) then 3 years later we get Raptor, followed by mantis 2 years afterwards, and 3 years after that we get woodstock express. (5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2,3,2,3) 1 season passes by and Millennium Force comes in with the new Record! 2 years later we get The Wicked Twister IMMEDIATELY followed by Dragster which is left as the newest addition up until 2007 (4 years later) with Maverick. Currently we stand at 5 years with Gatekeeper making the tally of the years in between: 5,2,6,2,1,6,4,2,3,2,3,1,2,1,4,5 I know there isn't much in the means of patterns here. Its like looking at 16 digits of pi. But it does show some potential for the park. Like when we got the 2 major Coasters a year apart from each other in 2002-03 or when the same happened in 1969-70 when we received 2 more family-oriented rides. I personally like the 1978-79 Gemini and Jr Gemini additions making a pair of coasters that go together. And to top it off 1999-2000 additions once again of a Jr coaster and a Big boy ride. Maybe its just my speculation but how cool would it be if the park added just one more kiddie coaster? in the front with Gatekeeper. "lil Griffon" "GateKeeper jr"? if the new 2014 ride / attraction is family oriented this could just as well be a possibility. But remember this is just my thoughts being shared with the community, not me spreading rumors. I'd just find it cool if we got an inverted kiddie coaster... (p.s. if the numbers up top confused you or made your brain hurt at all, I'm sorry, it was all in the 'Thinking out loud' process... )