Cedar Point (CP) Discussion Thread

[Skysthelimit]

This could be just my perception, not reality, but it over the years I don’t recall nearly as many issues with the structure compared to the launch system. Hydraulic launch aside, I’d be curious the remaining lifespan of the tower which has been fairly reliable given the other issues with the coaster. 
 

In any regard, I paid $215 for my wicked twister slice. I really hope they don’t repeat the same pricing exercise when Dragster’s true final day actually comes. 

[coasterbill]

Well it probably doesn’t have much wear and tear since the ride never runs…

[boldikus]

2 hours ago, Skysthelimit said:

In any regard, I paid $215 for my wicked twister slice.

[CaptainUnknown]

2 hours ago, Skysthelimit said:

In any regard, I paid $215 for my wicked twister slice. I really hope they don’t repeat the same pricing exercise when Dragster’s true final day actually comes. 

They'd charge $300 for a dragster slice today. In a few years with inflation, it'd only go up.

[BotanicalStig]

10 hours ago, CaptainUnknown said:

They'd charge $300 for a dragster slice today. In a few years with inflation, it'd only go up.

Meh. $250 or $300 maybe. I'll still buy one. 

 

Really not much for something if it has great sentimental value to you. I love my WT piece. 

[TurnOfTheCentury]

Well, I initially thought they would re-evaluate the ride and make serious changes to the launch.... knowing full-well that had nothing to do with the accident, but when I re-viewed the capacity and maintenance logs disclosed in the state investigation you could tell this ride was a maintenance HEADACHE with very, very low capacity.  So, it makes complete sense to consider what to do with it.  But then lots of people made valid comments about the expense of all that... and would it pay off?  Then I saw what they are doing to Montezoomas revenge, and that, on the surface, seemed to have as little economic sense as TTD re-do. .... Now I'm just confused.  but it's cools that CF leadership is interested in not just abandoning historic rides.

The obvious thing is to (somehow) convert it to LSM launch -- I just forget the math on whether they can reliably get it up to speed with a Ferrari World-type launch on the TTD launch length (is length the sole limiting factor or does the technology somehow tap out at a given speed?)- there is a substantial amount of post-launch straight track at the end of the launch and one could put LSM partially up the hill.  That seems to be quickest way to resolve the issue.  The reverse spike/launch idea seems way to complicated - not only are you building the spike, installing the LSM system, but you also now need to slide the station over or otherwise reconfigure the connection from the reverse spike to the launch because of capacity problems -  I don't think they could launch 24-person  (or bigger capacity) trains and the tophat wasn't configured for a long train?

For me, the true dream is that they will repurpose the enormous top hat for a full circuit conventional coaster - somehow get a near-vertical lift up there and then build off the break run out toward the lagoons or something (I know, will NOT happen....)

[coasterbill]

1 hour ago, TurnOfTheCentury said:

I just forget the math on whether they can reliably get it up to speed with a Ferrari World-type launch on the TTD launch length (is length the sole limiting factor or does the technology somehow tap out at a given speed?)

This is one of those things that I just ignore, not because it's necessarily wrong but it just strikes me as one of those things that someone said once and everyone just took it as gospel forever. None of us have any clue what the limitations are, and technology is always evolving. I'm sure it's possible if they want to do it. They can even put LIMs up a curved hill if they want to, Intamin does it all the time.

[Zand]

I thought LSMs would've been impossible on the amount of track they have before heading uphill, but eltororyan's video says I'm dead wrong. I didn't realize how little of the track the hydraulic launch actually uses.

[tndank]

Construction walls now surround TTD's station and area around it.

 

[BotanicalStig]

Such an iconic station to me

 

I remember my first ride on TTD. My best friend I (back in my high school days) went to cedar point together back in 07. We risked the ride going down (again) to sit in the front row and do it right. What a rush that was. Only got 3 or 4 rides on that trip. 

 

Only been back twice since then, really wish I could get on it again. 

[MartinU]

11 minutes ago, tndank said:

Construction walls now surround TTD's station and area around it.

 

Wait for the RMC trucks to start rolling in.  Their first steel refurb!

Everyone else is spouting wild and crazy ideas, thought I'd put on my tinfoil (top) hat and watch too. 

[_s3_]

Here are the pictures: (Originally by @cltkendall05 on Twitter)

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by _s3_
Original Twitter user/tweet deleted. Pictures posted.

[TurnOfTheCentury]

3 hours ago, coasterbill said:

This is one of those things that I just ignore, not because it's necessarily wrong but it just strikes me as one of those things that someone said once and everyone just took it as gospel forever. None of us have any clue what the limitations are, and technology is always evolving. I'm sure it's possible if they want to do it. They can even put LIMs up a curved hill if they want to, Intamin does it all the time.

Yeah, I agree.   I don't doubt they can find the length.  Just not sure the technology can get it up to 120mph or whatever (I bet it can - I just don't know of any ride that uses LSMs to achieve that speed - doesn't mean they couldn't.  It's only about 10 mph more than the Ferrari LSM coaster in Spain).  What I do have some doubts about is whether CF is willing to go right out to the cutting edge AGAIN with Intamin on LSM technology, on the SAME Ride when they went cutting edge and paid a steep price.....

But, given speculation is fun, I think they will simply keep the same ride profile, maybe change trains (lighter trains?), and essentially just replace the launch system and move the line . . ..  (Maybe fancy enclosed light show like Montezooma?)

[_s3_]

Thoughts of LSM limitations in terms of achievable speed are pretty moot. LSMs have been used in maglev high speed rail for years and have hit speeds over 300mph. The key is how much space is needed to achieve the desired speed, and whether or not TTD has that space.

To me, since speed is achievable and space is the concern, the sheer length comparison between Red Force and TTD's launch section leads me to think that it should definitely be possible to bridge 8mph difference without too much issue.

Trains would definitely need replaced with lighter, permanent magnet mounted versions.

[kenban]

There are two big LSM providers in the industry.  Indrivetec who is used by Intamin, and Intrasys who is used by the majority of the rest of the industry.  Indrivetec did Red Force.  Intrasys typically uses parallel rows of stators, for instance Thunderbird at Holiday World uses two rows of stators and that is a very heavy train.

My understanding is that you can just keep adding rows of stators as long as you have the proper spacing between them and room under the train for the permanent magnets.  I would bet Intrasys could build a launch with 3 rows of stators that could easily power even a 20 person train to 120 MPH, it might not be as short as the current TTD launch, but it does not need to be because there is a lot of space available.

Intamin very recently removed Dragster from their website.  I suspect whatever is being done, Cedar Fair hired someone else to do the work.  I cannot help but wonder if they talked B&M into designing custom trains, maybe something like the trains on Steel Dragon 2000, just 5 cars long.

[jarmor]

^ or they are actually getting rid of dragster all together and keeping on remnants of it to incorporate into a totally new ride but with the same or similar name.  You don't remove a ride just for some tweaking.

[prozach626]

3 hours ago, MartinU said:

Wait for the RMC trucks to start rolling in.  Their first steel refurb!

Everyone else is spouting wild and crazy ideas, thought I'd put on my tinfoil (top) hat and watch too. 

yeah thanks

[Skysthelimit]

9 hours ago, BotanicalStig said:

Meh. $250 or $300 maybe. I'll still buy one. 

 

Really not much for something if it has great sentimental value to you. I love my WT piece. 

I was referencing the fact that they priced WT based on the track heigh ($215 / 215 feet tall), meaning that dragster will be $420

[i305isdaddy]

It seems fairly obvious that they’re going to tunnel the launch and brake run to prevent debris and toss some LSM’s halfway up the pullout on the tower to just Red Force this thing right?

I can’t see anything else happening. 

[Doppel Looping]

Do they make aquatrax that tall?

[CoasterKid93]

Guys my friend's Dad works for Intamin and they said they're gonna install a compressed air launch. 0-135 in 0.8 seconds. -2.5gs over the top hat.

[Pedrinho]

30 minutes ago, CoasterKid93 said:

Guys my friend's Dad works for Intamin and they said they're gonna install a compressed air launch. 0-135 in 0.8 seconds. -2.5gs over the top hat.

Thank you for your insights. Thread closed. Sarcasm off.

[BotanicalStig]

6 hours ago, Doppel Looping said:

Do they make aquatrax that tall?

Hopefully they're finally going to use all of those aquatraxx parts for maverick that they forgot to install. 

 

Aquatraxx is the first idea in this thread that makes losing TTD OK. 

[KBrylczyk]

All these jokes about Aquatraxx and TTD, meanwhile SeaWorld San Antonio is (probably) getting a launched log flume.

[_s3_]

Someone posted this on Reddit today. From the looks, it appears on the left that all of the cables have been severed/removed from the control boxes that monitor and/or control launch brake fins. Pretty much confirms removal of the hydraulic launch.