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Valleyfair (VF) Discussion Thread


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^^That's the first time that I have ever heard a complaint about Millennium Flyers. Those things are remarkably nice.

 

Yeah. I mean I get the unfortunate placement of the buckle, but I can't think of a more comfortable train design than the millennium flyers. The RMC trains aren't bad, but they've got the shin bars which would be unnecessary on a GCI, and outside of that your other option is pretty much PTCs. Those are far worse.

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^^That's the first time that I have ever heard a complaint about Millennium Flyers. Those things are remarkably nice.

 

Yeah. I mean I get the unfortunate placement of the buckle, but I can't think of a more comfortable train design than the millennium flyers. The RMC trains aren't bad, but they've got the shin bars which would be unnecessary on a GCI, and outside of that your other option is pretty much PTCs. Those are far worse.

 

Or we could just put High Roller trains on everything, just without the seat belts!

 

Seriously, High Roller's trains are like couches.

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I really like Renegade's trains. Corkscrew has good trains and I couldn't imagine it with any different. Wild Thing has self-defeating trains. As a ride it delivers so little airtime that all the extra room does nothing for the experience. So what good is it? The high walls of the trains only serve to limit your exposure to the wind and air, and following train design trends, we know that isn't what modern parkgoers want.

 

Wild Thing is a speed coaster. Not an air coaster. Morgan hypers were not made for airtime and are not marketed to parks as providing it. Height and speed is what they provide. I just want Wild Thing to have trains that amplify its strengths. I don't think riding in a bathtub makes it feel faster or more thrilling.

 

But again, it won't happen. Even if I want it to...

 

This really does seem to be the most divisive subject on the Valleyfair forum, lol.

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Except that when the mid-course block brakes aren't applied heavily, the bunny hops on the Morgan hypers do provide airtime. I don't know where you got the info that Morgan hypers aren't supposed to have negative g's, but I always got the impression they were going for a less aggressive version of Magnum.

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The Chance Morgan website is a good resource. "...all about SPEED" (notice the caps, not mine) is said in the ride type description--they know exactly what they are selling. They clearly are emphasizing that one aspect, not airtime or laterals or whatever. But I feel that the trains they are using do nothing to play up that aspect. So why not just go for it and put trains on the track that can really put the rider in a position to feel the speed? That is what the layout is designed for.

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This really does seem to be the most divisive subject on the Valleyfair forum, lol.

 

It's divisive because it's stupid. The only people who ever complain about wild thing's trains are enthusiasts.

 

Also, the ride's 2nd hill still provides a nice pop of sustained floater that still holds up well in 2015.

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There's floater and there's ejector...and while your concern about shin restraints makes sense on ejector, it doesn't on floater. And sure Wild Thing might be able to deliver decent ejector on the last hills when the mid-course brakes aren't heavily used... but let's be honest, that's so rare that people have to hunt for footage of it from the 90s.

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Those of us in the over 6' tall category find them uncomfortable at all times. I haven't been on lightning run, but I can say that every premiere I've ridden that has shin bars has been an excruciating (though usually worth it!) experience.

 

At the end of the day, regardless of how "good" the other trains may be, this won't happen unless a significant amount of park guests have a problem with the current trains. It costs money to buy new trains, and I don't understand why you all would want VF's seemingly limited budget to go to that instead of to new attractions, or other infrastructure stuff that actually is a problem or an obstacle to growth.

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While we're on the whole WT topic, has anyone ridden Mamba at WOF? I'm interested to hear how it compares to WT or M-XL200. Mamba was featured on insane coaster wars so you would think it would be known as a respectable hyper-coaster.

 

I haven't been on Wild Thing, but from watching POVs it looks almost identical to Mamba, which I have always found pretty average. (Not awful, just average, and I quite like WOF as a whole.) It doesn't compare favorably to XL200 from 10 years earlier, Titan from the same year, or any number of hypers built since. I'm not sure why it would have been on a TV show.

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At the end of the day, regardless of how "good" the other trains may be, this won't happen unless a significant amount of park guests have a problem with the current trains. It costs money to buy new trains, and I don't understand why you all would want VF's seemingly limited budget to go to that instead of to new attractions, or other infrastructure stuff that actually is a problem or an obstacle to growth.

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I think they need to put their money towards a new coaster first, instead of buying new trains. Wild Thing is good the way it is. Sure it's no top 5 coaster, but it is a hyper and has good speed. More pressing is our lack of a B&M, and inverted full circuit, and a coaster with more inversions.

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There's floater and there's ejector...and while your concern about shin restraints makes sense on ejector, it doesn't on floater. And sure Wild Thing might be able to deliver decent ejector on the last hills when the mid-course brakes aren't heavily used... but let's be honest, that's so rare that people have to hunt for footage of it from the 90s.

I found this footage on YouTube of some enthusiasts getting a brake-free ride on Wild Thing from 1999. It looks like it provided some strong ejector airtime. I would honestly pay extra to get a ride like this.

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While we're on the whole WT topic, has anyone ridden Mamba at WOF? I'm interested to hear how it compares to WT or M-XL200. Mamba was featured on insane coaster wars so you would think it would be known as a respectable hyper-coaster.

 

I prefer Mamba over Wild Thing but I will take Steel Eel over both. While it's under 200 feet, it provides tons of air.

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The two key differences are the color schemes and the layout after the third hill. Wild thing goes through a high helix and then a low helix, and mamba drops down to the ground and just does a low helix. I prefer wild things layout and colors so I prefer Wild Thing. Steel force also has different colors and a different layout than wild thing. I like its layout the same but not the colors.

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This is exactly how I feel about it. I just really don't understand why everyone keeps saying these trains should be replaced. They work fine and are comfortable, so there is no need to change them.

 

They should use the money for something else, like a new flat, a new restauraunt, new trash cans, whatever! I just really don't see the need for new trains.

 

The only reason everyone (hard core coaster enthusiasts/fan boys) keep saying WT's trains need to be replaced is just a reflection of how average and 'non-thrilling' the ride actually is. Enthusiasts just want a more thrilling ride experience for a Hyper coaster which happens to be the biggest and 'baddest ride in the park' but really isn't. It will not happen and shouldn't happen because like you said there is so much more the park could do with that money. Morgans are just not thrilling hypers, they are pretty tame actually so I get why people suggest this modification in hopes of a fix that would improve the ride experience which it probably would not by a noticeable amount. Too bad VF did not get an Arrow Hyper like Magnum, it has roughly the same layout but a much more thrilling ride with the quicker and more forceful turn around along with air on the bunny hills back to the station. WT used to offer air on its bunny hills but since they adjusted the mid course brake it does not anymore.

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Nope, won't ever happen. The B&M trains on Steel Dragon 2000 have a height limit cap of 6' 1" due to the higher seating those trains have compared to the previous Morgan trains, which at 6' 1" would pretty much prevent a large chunk of the US male population from riding it. Has to make the proper clearance, hence the rather low height limit. Those B&M trains were a one-off and we'll more than likely never see B&M do another retrofit like that again. The only reason why those Morgan trains were replaced is that they were mechanically insufficient to meet Japan's stricter rules on their coasters. This is after all one of the coasters that made Japan increase their mechanical requirements on their coasters.

 

The only time we'll ever see new trains ordered for any of Cedar Fair's coasters is if they plan on doing something like Rougarou and it'll drastically improve the comfort of the ride, or if something catastrophic were to happen, but because Chance is still providing parts for the Morgan rides and coasters, the chance of new trains getting installed "just because" is extremely low. It's the same thing with the Arrow coasters as well. As long as S&S is still making parts for them, they're also not going anywhere anytime soon, unless it can drastically improve the ride experience like what's happening with Rougarou.

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^ you wouldnt want a rough arrow leg killer

 

Magnum doesn't hurt my legs at all, maybe because I am 6' 1''. Even if it did hurt some it would still be a better and more thrilling ride than WT. For a Hyper coaster WT is pretty weak. After the first drop (good airtime) and the first camel back hill the ride is basically over. It then meanders through the turn around and becomes almost lifeless on the bunny hills back to the station just barely providing some pops of air on the good runs. I personally wish WT had a station at the mid-brake where you could get off because for me the ride ends there.

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