Snowyowl1028 Posted February 2, 2015 Posted February 2, 2015 You all keep saying a vekoma isn't going to happen and I agree. B and m is way more likely since cedar fair has been buying from them a lot lately.
MinnesotaFriedOreo Posted February 2, 2015 Posted February 2, 2015 I thought Windjammer Surf Racers at Knotts was bought by CF, I could easily be wrong though lol Cedar Fair bought Knotts later that season...
ariznglori Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 Been looking at Google Maps and got an idea. What if Mad Mouse was relocated and the path to the Renegade area followed the ending turnaround of High Roller, then met up with the back path on the spot of Wheel of Fortune? It shouldn't cost the park too much in the way of lost buildings and it would open up a massive chunk for future waterpark expansion. It wouldn't be hard to find a new spot for Mad Mouse and Wheel of Fortune either, so no loss...it's the only thing I can see being done to add a substantial amount of land to the waterpark in the future.
VF15 Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 ^ From what I've heard, when Valleyfair has another waterpark expansion in a few years, they will probably be removing the Panic Falls slides to make room for it. Don't get me wrong, I like your idea, but it probably wouldn't happen for a while, that is unless they decide to do more than just replace those old slides in the coming years.
ariznglori Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 In regards to accessing a theoretical new ride in the parking lot area that was coned off...would a path have to be built over Dinos Alive, or could the backstage access by High Roller's lift hill be utilized instead? I haven't done the Dinos walkthrough, so I'm not sure of the attraction's extent.
VF15 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 ^ There doesn't seem to be a way to build a direct path to that (theoretical) area on the ground. Maybe they could relocate/get rid of the restrooms near High Roller's turnaround and build a bridge over Dinosaurs Alive, but I'm not so sure they would do that. If we do get a new coaster there, maybe we could get a new entrance plaza along with that, and they could probably create enough space for a path between the entrance and the Dinos.
rcoaster10 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 ^There doesn't seem to be a way to build a direct path to that (theoretical) area on the ground. Maybe they could relocate/get rid of the restrooms near High Roller's turnaround and build a bridge over Dinosaurs Alive, but I'm not so sure they would do that. If we do get a new coaster there, maybe we could get a new entrance plaza along with that, and they could probably create enough space for a path between the entrance and the Dinos. I posted a pic showing a coaster over that spot (Talon), to which you actually replied to back on page 174. I still think that would be a great location for the new coaster. It could even do a flyover of the front gate and could continue to go down to the amphitheater and do a turn around there. I was doing a little research on Google Maps about where a new coaster could go. There is a plot of land that is currently occupied by Dinosaurs Alive, but there have been rumors that Cedar Fair only has the Dinos for a while. If the new coaster didn't come for another 2, 3, even 4 years, that might be a possibility. I photoshopped Talon onto the spot where the dinos currently are and it fits perfectly. An invert of similar size similar to Talon would fit the land and budget perfectly. It would give a great front of the park impression similar to what CF has been doing with GateKeeper, Leviathan, and the rumored coaster at Carowinds.
ariznglori Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 That fits so well it's spooky. What would Patriot look like in the same spot?
WarpedHorizon Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 A few pages back I posted my mediocre gimp job of Raptor tucked into Dinos & the former picnic area: Dang Dinos are wrecking all of the easy solutions. But recent talk has given me a radical idea- the current admin building is too small. Tear it out, and relocated it. Put in a coaster and a few flat rides, and maybe fit in a new first aid/security building. Build a new admin building with more offices, bigger locker rooms, better classrooms, better haunt staging area, and more storage. Here's a visual I drew up in Paint: It's totally insane, and will probably never happen, and yet.... never say never. It solves two issues with one big concentrated project, so it's not too insane.
ariznglori Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Dinos should leave in 2019 I think--then the front of the park can really be optimized for a good coaster. I suspect the next coaster (invert) may be coming sooner than that...so then it's back to the amphitheater space/Wild Thing helix, Excalibur's spot, or the backstage buildings gotta go...or some brilliant curveball we won't see coming is on its way. There is no obvious good solution with the current set-up.
VF15 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Looking like winter again at the construction site. They took away that tarp that was over the slide tower concrete, and it looks like they're doing something new at the splash pad spot. Only 100 days left until Valleyfair opens.
GCI Wooden Posted February 5, 2015 Posted February 5, 2015 Ok everyone, just heard back from Mr. Frazier. He is going to have his marketing director call me to discuss details about restarting a coaster craze event! What sort of things would you like to see? This is not a for sure thing yet but its a possibility. Respond asap cause i don't know when he/she will call. Well, I am over a week late, but this idea came to my head, Renegade walk back. Have they called yet?
garyman6 Posted February 5, 2015 Posted February 5, 2015 Ok everyone, just heard back from Mr. Frazier. He is going to have his marketing director call me to discuss details about restarting a coaster craze event! What sort of things would you like to see? This is not a for sure thing yet but its a possibility. Respond asap cause i don't know when he/she will call. Well, I am over a week late, but this idea came to my head, Renegade walk back. Have they called yet? No call yet, I'll let you all know when they do.
ariznglori Posted February 5, 2015 Posted February 5, 2015 If Valleyfair were given $50 million like Carowinds for development, how would you like to see it spent? Here's how I'd break it down: $15 million toward a Talon-like invert in the Dinos spot $20 million for a custom Intamin to replace Excalibur, something akin to Skyrush that doesn't have issues with the height restrictions and that is worth the walk back...the park's new signature coaster for the next few decades These two rides would cement Valleyfair as a must-visit destination in Minnesota. Okay, only 15 million to go... I'll throw five of that at a Windseeker in Wild Thing's turnaround and the other ten at additional waterpark expansion and infrastructure improvements including moving Mad Mouse, Wheel of Fortune and Looping Starship to make room for more slide complexes and space for sunchairs. Paths would be rerouted, but the backstage facilities would not need heavy adjustments. Other projects that are a good idea, perhaps in lieu of the Intamin: High quality dark ride where bumper cars are (relocation of bumper cars to field by Corkscrew) New RMC in the place of the amphitheater (because coaster-knot epicness and an excellent collection of woodies) Launch coaster to replace Excalibur, something like Xcelerator or Rita maybe New trains/reprofile Wild Thing, including steeper drops of at least 75 degrees and removal of MCBR. But that's me.
VF15 Posted February 5, 2015 Posted February 5, 2015 Not sure if $50 million is the amount of money that Cedar Fair plans on investing in Valleyfair, but if that was the case, then this is what I'd choose from $44 million ($6 million already spent on waterpark expansion). This list likely won't be exactly what happens, but I can dream, right? -$15 million: B&M invert that's small to medium-sized but forceful (replaces Dinos or coned section of parking lot). -$5 million: HUSS Giant Frisbee (replaces Amphitheater). -$6 million: Waterpark Expansion #2 (replaces Panic Falls slides and old Splash Station). -$10 million: Insane RMC woodie (replaces Excalibur). -$1 million: Larson Flyers (in Route 76). -$5 million: Redesigning of Wild Thing's turnaound by Chance, new ride computer, and new brakes to allow it to run without strong braking. -Remaining $2 million: General improvements.
dippindotsguy8 Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 (edited) Not sure why everyone's saying Wildthing needs to be re-profiled/given new trains/given steeper drops. It's a solid ride. Even if it's not among the best hypers out there by enthusiasts standards, it's still a very popular attraction that most guests thoroughly enjoy. I know somebody's gonna talk about the Mantis/Rougarou transformation, but that happened because it gave a bad ride in it's original form. As for other things people listed, I can definitely see... 1. More waterpark down the road 2. Coaster either in the amphitheater's spot or the dinos/old picnics area 3. Flyers in Route 76 4. A major flat somewhere (Not a Huss frisbee though... Isn't Huss kinda on the rocks with everyone right now?) 5. A fairly significant amount (more than a couple million) thrown at general improvements/infrastructure. Think about the current condition of the parking lot, possible need to move service roads to make room for things, etc. Even the non-exciting stuff like roads, knocking down buildings and replacing them, etc is decently expensive. 6. Something done with Excalibur, whether it's eventually removed, remodeled, who knows. It's an aging Arrow that's not exactly the biggest draw. I wouldn't say it's unpopular, but it's not a star attraction necessarily. 7. Something I really want for selfish reasons is one of the full-sized Technical Park Pegasus rides. They're super fun! It's like a better Chaos with higher capacity. Edited February 6, 2015 by dippindotsguy8
Mdcastle Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 I'm not sure what stuff costs, but I'd say 1) Replace Excalibur with something people will actually walk to the back of the park for. 2) Tube slides, a racer, and a flowrider. 3) Fix the Thunder Canyon waterfalls and replace the asphalt between the entry plaza and Camp Snoopy with pavers. 4) Decent flats to fill in the empty space near Route 76, and replace the amphitheater, StupidCat, and Wheel of Misfortune. 5) Restore the existing sign and put it in Route 76 Bonus if you could fit a Windseeker or a watercoaster in.
Lareson Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 If Valleyfair was given a $50 million budget, I'd see a few things come into the park, but probably a bit of it would be spent on infrastructure and it would be spread over at least 3-5 years. At least 1, maybe 2 coasters - an invert roughly costing $15mil first then some sort of family thriller a few years later like something along the lines of a Moto Coaster or Firechaser Express, costing roughly $10mil. At least a couple flats such as a Larson Flying Scooters, Zamperla Air Race, a Chance Freestyle or some sort of pendulum ride like a Zamperla Discovery or a Chance Revolution. (I REALLY doubt Cedar Fair would buy another HUSS Frisbee after the many issues maXair and Delirium have been having the past couple years. Too many blown gear boxes.) A $5mil, 250ft tall WindSeeker, possibly a 32-person capacity one like the one that was installed at Adventureland in Iowa. They're much more reliable now that the bugs have been worked out of them. A rather large water park expansion, moving at least Mad Mouse and Looping Starship, and installing a ProSlide Tornado, a Wild Water West play structure, and of course new tube slides and possibly a mat racer. The rest would be spent on infrastructure improvements such as upgrading bathrooms, (no idea on the condition of them now, but just an idea) removing the remaining black top and replacing it with pavers, an updated front entrance to make it a bit more open (my suggestion was to keep it the way it is right now, but get rid of the gift shops on either side of it to make that part a bit wider) and some of the other minor suggestions people have also suggested. That seems very doable for the budget, but in reality, I only see Valleyfair given about a $20-30mil improvement budget over a few years and that includes only 1 major coaster ($10-15mil,) 1 or 2 major flats, a couple water park attractions, and the rest infrastructure and general improvements. The park really does have some potential in growing in the market, but it really can't grow as quickly as some of you want it to be without overdoing it like what Six Flags has done in the past. This park might be the 2nd smallest park in the chain right now, but it could move up a couple places and potentially surpass Worlds of Fun and CA Great America. Of course it'll never be in the top 6 parks (Canada's Wonderland, Cedar Point, Kings Island, Knott's, Carowinds, and Kings Dominion) but it definitely could surpass CA Great America, Worlds of Fun and maybe even Dorney.
Rollercoaster Rider Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 A Gatekeeper like ride to revamp the Entrance ($25m) Waterpark Expansion with a Family Water Play Area ($6m) RMC Wooden Coaster ($12m) Wonder Mountain's Guardian like Attraction ($10m) OK, 53 Million But Still Possible
RCjunkie Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 -$15 million: B&M invert that's small to medium-sized but forceful (replaces Dinos or coned section of parking lot). -$5 million: HUSS Giant Frisbee (replaces Amphitheater). -$6 million: Waterpark Expansion #2 (replaces Panic Falls slides and old Splash Station). -$10 million: Insane RMC woodie (replaces Excalibur). -$1 million: Larson Flyers (in Route 76). -$5 million: Redesigning of Wild Thing's turnaound by Chance, new ride computer, and new brakes to allow it to run without strong braking. -Remaining $2 million: General improvements. My wish list is pretty much the same as VF15's. A Floorless or Invert works for me, pure fantasy would be a Maverick like Intamin. I would just use the last $2 million for restoration of the Carousel (just because it is my guess that the $50 million dedicated to Carowinds does not include general maintenance). Maybe it is because I am just old but that Carousel is a classic, built in 1925 and was the one ride that came from the previous Excelsior park before it closed down creating a market for VF to be built. Plus I just think that for about 90% of people their first ride as a small child is on a Carousel and every park needs one because of that in my opinion. Plus they just don't make them like that anymore with the real wooden horses and I would like to see that part of park history preserved for as long as possible.
Snowyowl1028 Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 My way to spend 50 million. Not to best fit the park but what I would want to see! 333 foot b&m giga ( to make possible remove Excalibur make the lift go off that way where height limit doesn't apply then when it is at its peak it will turn around and drop down the way it came. Then it will doge around soak city, the renegade, and thunder canyon) -33 million Funnel slides and colorful tube slides and racing slides to replace the old slides but keep the raging Rapids thing - 11 million Wind seeker by the entrance of Dino land - 5 million Make the park look nicer and general improvements - 1 million By the way when I made this it somehow seemed like 50 wasn't enough. Oh well
VF15 Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 My wish list is pretty much the same as VF15's. A Floorless or Invert works for me, pure fantasy would be a Maverick like Intamin. I would just use the last $2 million for restoration of the Carousel (just because it is my guess that the $50 million dedicated to Carowinds does not include general maintenance). Maybe it is because I am just old but that Carousel is a classic, built in 1925 and was the one ride that came from the previous Excelsior park before it closed down creating a market for VF to be built. Plus I just think that for about 90% of people their first ride as a small child is on a Carousel and every park needs one because of that in my opinion. Plus they just don't make them like that anymore with the real wooden horses and I would like to see that part of park history preserved for as long as possible. I read a while back in this thread that Dave Frazier was considering a carousel refurbishment in the near future. It would probably be more of a general improvement than a major project, so I'd be all for it if it happens. Also, if a HUSS Giant Frisbee is not going to happen like Lareson says, then I'm not really sure what flat ride we could get. Correct me if I'm wrong, but with the exception of the CP and Carowinds Slingshots, Cedar Fair hasn't been getting many thrilling flat rides recently (Northern Lights was more fun than I was expecting, but it's definitely not a thrill ride).
ariznglori Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 Valleyfair has a great flat ride collection for a park its size. I think the only thing they're really lacking for me is a tall swings like Windseeker/Star Flyer, and a Windseeker is the more affordable of the two by several million. What the park truly lacks is one or two big coasters that deliver serious thrills/airtime/inversions, an entertaining dark ride, and a sizeable high quality waterpark--and the space for all these things without costly changes. And gosh are those things expensive anyway! I know my 50 mil proposal felt like it went too fast... But on the plus side, any of these additions should increase attendance and the likelihood that the rest get done sooner. It's just a question of what comes next and how it fits. Which is seriously tough. Let's just push the highway further away.
coasterchitchat Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 What about a Zamperla Giant Discovery? I mean it is Zamperla's take on a HUSS Frisbee, and with Cedar Fair buying a lot of rides from Zamperla lately, a Giant Discovery in my opinion would be more likely than a HUSS Frisbee. The HUSS Frisbee has too many maintenance issues, and when was the last time Cedar Fair (or even Six Flags) bought a brand, new ride from HUSS?
Lareson Posted February 6, 2015 Posted February 6, 2015 I don't think ANY US parks have bought anything from HUSS since the whole Dollywood and Timber Tower lawsuit. I have seen a new Chinese park build a new Frisbee and Top Spin, but those are about all I've seen. I do have a feeling with Cedar Fair buying rides from Larson and Zamperla, they'll start going through their catalogs and picking out new rides for the chain. I would love to get one of Larson's Super Shot drop towers at Michigan's Adventure since I've heard they've been hesitant about buying a S&S tower because of the high maintenance with the pneumatic system. And a Zamperla Discovery would be a perfect substitute for a Frisbee type ride for Valleyfair and a couple of the other parks in the chain. Heck, even an Air Race would work well for a couple parks. So far, the gaps Cedar Fair has been filling are for family thrill rides with height requirements in between 36" and 46" and so far, the Flying Scooters and Disk-O's have fit that bill pretty perfectly. It's also why Cedar Point didn't add theirs to a kid's area because they wanted them to be "bridge" rides, where the 8-12 year old group were becoming a bit too old for the Snoopy areas, but they might not be quite ready (or tall enough) for the big flats like maXair or Power Tower. By the way, those that have rode Black Widow at Kennywood and one of the HUSS Frisbees, how do the two compare?
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