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The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

Page 2228 - Wonder Woman Flight of Courage REAL POV!

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^ Ya I know you all meant on rollercoasters. But seriously I just can't take it when people categorize Americans in any aspect. I mean do you really believe nationality has anything to do with peoples fears of a ride.

 

Yes. It's a culture thing. Granted, as America is a melting pot it has a much bigger base than most countries, but it does influence it. Look up some of Robb's videos from China and watch how they ride their rides. They hold on for dear life where in the US many throw their hands up. Americans are different from Germans, who are different from Chinese, who are different from Russians. In the US we have a system that allows people to sue for ANYTHING really, and that alone keeps parks from building/running some rides like they should. I know first hand how parks have modified rides because of people saying they were too extreme. It happens.

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Anyways, back to speculating on LJ's replacement and construction for Lex Luthor

 

Just out of curiosity, am I the only one hoping for/expecting a Verbolten or Cheetah Hunt style of launched coaster (multiple launches, one to, say, take riders over Superman and the other side of the mountain, and a second launch for the return journey) or a Eurofighter for LJ's spot?

Edited by coasterking2981
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True story: anyone who has ever worked as a ride operator at a roller coaster will tell you that one of the most common questions is "is it scary?" If the roller coaster happens to be indoors, the #2 question will be "does it have loops?"

 

End of discussion.

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True story: anyone who has ever worked as a ride operator at a roller coaster will tell you that one of the most common questions is "is it scary?" If the roller coaster happens to be indoors, the #2 question will be "does it have loops?"

 

End of discussion.

 

Revival of discussion.

When I visited Kings Dominion with my girlfriend this summer, as we were about to board Flight of Fear, she looked at the lapbars and asked, "does this go upside down?" I said, "Yes, four times," and she freaked out a bit. I don't think she believed me until she was actually upside down. At least she enjoyed the ride; plus she's now an Enthusiast-in-Training

 

Re-end of discussion.

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True story: anyone who has ever worked as a ride operator at a roller coaster will tell you that one of the most common questions is "is it scary?" If the roller coaster happens to be indoors, the #2 question will be "does it have loops?"

Not to be out done by every second guest crouching down as they walk past the height check and saying they are too small.

 

Back to MM though.....I hope it does get replaced with a water ride. As an infrequent guest who visits in the off season I find I get a case of coaster fatigue. It does say a lot for the parks line up when you have several excellent rides that would stand out in any other park but are merely back ground filler rides.

So a replacement log flume would be great. Not to mention the fact that it gets fairly hot in Valencia, so getting a chance to cool down would be nice.

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^ Ya I know you all meant on rollercoasters. But seriously I just can't take it when people categorize Americans in any aspect. I mean do you really believe nationality has anything to do with peoples fears of a ride.

Yes. There are stereotypes for a reason. Congrats on defending our country....but when it comes to theme parks and roller coasters, in general, the American audience needs to have things a bit watered down, and certainly more idiot proof. Not as much watered down as, let's say, for the Japanese audience who prefers really tame rides, but when you look at some rides in Europe versus rides in America, there are some crazy things there that would never fly here. And not with just intense rides, but also when it comes to safety and common sense. Why do you think there are so many more rules, restraints, and restrictions when it comes to our parks?

 

I remember doing crowd control outside of Splash Mountain and people coming up to me freaking out about the ride. And I'd say "Ma'am, it's a family log flume that most 4 to 5 year olds can ride." and they'd point to the drop and say "I don't care....I'm not getting on THAT thing!!!!" And this is Splash freaking Mountain!!! I remember people getting upset because they didn't know Pirates of the Caribbean had a "drop" and you'd say "That drop is about the size of your average playground slide" and they be all "Doesn't matter.... it scared the crap out of me!"

 

Here's another scenario for you to think about.... A ride like Top Thrill Dragster has an hourly capacity of about 1,000 people. Your average park day at Cedar Point is about 12 hours. That only leaves room for about 12,000 people per day to ride. Well, in 2007, for example, the average daily attendance for Cedar Point was 22,000 people. That's an average of 10,000 people who didn't ride Top Thrill Dragster each day. And I can tell you, they didn't not ride it because the line was too long and were turned away, they didn't ride it because they simply didn't want to go on it! There are more people freaked out about thrill rides than you think.

 

Look, I don't know the first thing about defending a country, so I'll trust your judgement in that, but I do know a thing or two about park operations, so why don't you trust that my comments are sincere? Personally, I think it's quite naive of you to not want to listen to facts about our country just because you are in the military. None of what I'm saying is "Anti-American" at all, it's just simply factual data about the people who live in this country, their likes/dis-likes and certain trends. BTW, America is also fatter than most of the rest of the world. Are you going to deny that fact as well?

 

--Robb "Who would love to see a Zac-Spin run in the US like Insane does...but I know that would last about 30 seconds..." Alvey

Edited by robbalvey
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^ Ya I know you all meant on rollercoasters. But seriously I just can't take it when people categorize Americans in any aspect. I mean do you really believe nationality has anything to do with peoples fears of a ride.

Yes. There are stereotypes for a reason. Congrats on defending our country....but when it comes to theme parks and roller coasters, in general, the American audience needs to have things a bit watered down, and certainly more idiot proof. Not as much watered down as, let's say, for the Japanese audience who prefers really tame rides, but when you look at some rides in Europe versus rides in America, there are some crazy things there that would never fly here. And not with just intense rides, but also when it comes to safety and common sense. Why do you think there are so many more rules, restraints, and restrictions when it comes to our parks?

 

I remember doing crowd control outside of Splash Mountain and people coming up to me freaking out about the ride. And I'd say "Ma'am, it's a family log flume that most 4 to 5 year olds can ride." and they'd point to the drop and say "I don't care....I'm not getting on THAT thing!!!!" And this is Splash freaking Mountain!!! I remember people getting upset because they didn't know Pirates of the Caribbean had a "drop" and you'd say "That drop is about the size of your average playground slide" and they be all "Doesn't matter.... it scared the crap out of me!"

 

Here's another scenario for you to think about.... A ride like Top Thrill Dragster has an hourly capacity of about 1,000 people. Your average park day at Cedar Point is about 12 hours. That only leaves room for about 12,000 people per day to ride. Well, in 2007, for example, the average daily attendance for Cedar Point was 22,000 people. That's an average of 10,000 people who didn't ride Top Thrill Dragster each day. And I can tell you, they didn't not ride it because the line was too long and were turned away, they didn't ride it because they simply didn't want to go on it! There are more people freaked out about thrill rides than you think.

 

Look, I don't know the first thing about defending a country, so I'll trust your judgement in that, but I do know a thing or two about park operations, so why don't you trust that my comments are sincere? Personally, I think it's quite naive of you to not want to listen to facts about our country just because you are in the military. None of what I'm saying is "Anti-American" at all, it's just simply factual data about the people who live in this country, their likes/dis-likes and certain trends. BTW, America is also fatter than most of the rest of the world. Are you going to deny that fact as well?

 

--Robb "Who would love to see a Zac-Spin run in the US like Insane does...but I know that would last about 30 seconds..." Alvey

 

So it's factual data that Americans are wimpy on rides? Alright, I guess I'll take your word for it since you are rob alvey. And no, I would not deny that Americans are the fastest. It's quite evident, it just a little hard to believe what you were saying since I doubt anyone had actually gathered data on coaster wimpyness. Hahaha

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^ It's my job to travel around the world, including ALL of the United States and collect data by observing trends at parks, not to mention that I did actually spend 5 years working in theme parks with guests, and on top of that I work closely with a lot of ride manufacturers that install rides in different parts of the world, and I hear what they have to say regarding cultural trends. I'm probably one of the top five most traveled individuals in the theme park business. When you have done the same and collected data from the majority of the planet, please enlighten us with your findings.

 

Personally, I think you're just being a typical "Ugly American" with your obnoxious responses. You don't want to hear what I have to say, so you're being rude and abrasive as a means to justify your stance. Like I said, I am not being Anti-American in the slightest, I'm simply reporting on what I see, experienced, and know. If you don't like what I have to say, don't post to our forum. Besides, don't you have a country to defend or something?

 

--Robb "I don't question you about your job, so please don't question me about mine." Alvey

Edited by robbalvey
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^ I'm doing a slow clap in my head right now.

 

I've worked in and around the amusement park industry for about 8 years and what Robb says is totally accurate. I've had people crying hysterically and begging to get off of rides like Roar at SFDK cause they were so scared. Roar is only 100' tall and dwarfed by most of the other coasters in the park yet people cannot handle it. And I can't tell you how many of my friends don't even bother going to parks because they are too afraid of coasters and would rather not spend the money.

 

It's also probably good to point out that a park like Cedar Point that is an excellent quality park with huge thrill rides doesn't even come close to the popularity of something like a Disney park in the US. That's got to be somewhat attributed to the fact that Disney parks are much more tame.

 

 

--On a side note I have not ridden GL at SFMM nor do I know much about how Insane is operated, what's the big difference?

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^ Insane will run like a bat out of hell, spinning like effing crazy the entire time, not trimmed as much as Green Lantern, doesn't stop of the block brake for as long, etc, etc...

 

That being said, I have also had mediocre rides on Insane due to just the off-balance or timing on the thing, and I've also heard of people getting good rides on GL. The "norm" would seem to be that you get better rides on Insane more often than you do on GL.

 

Also, thanks for backing me up. Again, it's not like I'm trying to argue or anything, I've just worked in this business since I was 17 years old and it really bugs me to be questioned from a guy who seems to know nothing about trends in this business. I'm only try to better educate people based on my 25 years of experience in theme parks. If they don't want to agree with what I have to say, that's fine, but don't be all obnoxious and tell me I'm wrong, because I'm not.

 

--Robb "Holy crap, has it really been that long?!?!?" Alvey

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Sorry for the off topic post but I also would like to comment on the "how intense are rides in which country" issue.

 

Yes. It's a culture thing ... In the US we have a system that allows people to sue for ANYTHING really, and that alone keeps parks from building/running some rides like they should.

 

I can only agree with that and what Robb said since I noticed pretty much the same thing during all of my visits to the US.

Here is a good example when it comes to water parks.

 

Me and a friend have been to this awesome water park called Area47 in Austria last summer. Here is an overview picture and two videos of my favorite rides there. By the way, their diving platform ist ajustable and can go up to 88,5 feet. Non professionals are allowed to jump from up to 65 feet which is a total blast!

Now Imagine rides like that at Splashin Safari or Hurricane Harbour for instance. I just could never see this kind of park and rides work in the US since the average visitor would most certainly hurt themselves and sue the carp out of who ever is running the place.

In Europe on the other hand stuff like this works just fine so yes, I do think nationality has something to do with peoples fears of a ride.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1o55cSQtKA

 

 

Edited by robbalvey
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^ Insane will run like a bat out of hell, spinning like effing crazy the entire time, not trimmed as much as Green Lantern, doesn't stop of the block brake for as long, etc, etc...

 

That being said, I have also had mediocre rides on Insane due to just the off-balance or timing on the thing, and I've also heard of people getting good rides on GL. The "norm" would seem to be that you get better rides on Insane more often than you do on GL.

 

Also, thanks for backing me up. Again, it's not like I'm trying to argue or anything, I've just worked in this business since I was 17 years old and it really bugs me to be questioned from a guy who seems to know nothing about trends in this business. I'm only try to better educate people based on my 25 years of experience in theme parks. If they don't want to agree with what I have to say, that's fine, but don't be all obnoxious and tell me I'm wrong, because I'm not.

 

--Robb "Holy crap, has it really been that long?!?!?" Alvey

 

Can't argue with 25 years of experience, dealing with guests, travelling to damn near every park on the planet (or is it EVERY park?), and working with the people and companies which actually make these rides.

 

Um yeah, there is no argument.

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On the wimpiness argument, it really depends on the person. I've seen people chicken out of riding a chair swing and I've seen people rave about aggressive rides like El Toro, Maverick, and I305 like they were nothing.

 

The general public IS pretty slow-witted though. You can't argue that. You can't really argue that the country is very lawsuit heavy either. Sucks that we can't have more extreme flat rides that run on more intense cycles.

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As always, Robb is right. While I haven't traveled quite as much as he has, I have been out of the US a lot, and have witnessed many of the same things. Not only are US residents much more afraid of things at parks, they're more afraid of life in general. And of course, will sue if they so much as get dizzy walking outside their home. People often say a Megalite should be built in the US, and having ridden them, I can tell you that they are WAY too forceful for the average US park visitor, and the only way one will ever be built here is if it's trimmed to death and/or has the most insane restraint system ever, as people would be complaining that "the ride is trying to kill them!". Something like Insane would have lawyers para-dropping into the park 30 seconds after it started to operate. There is NO WAY a ride like that could ever be built in the US.

 

And this isn't "anti-American" or whatever dumb label people want to put on this, just facts based on years of industry experience and traveling and observations. No wonder forceless B&M coasters are so popular...

 

dt

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With all due respect Robb, you should be thankful that people like me are "obnoxious" enough to defend Americans to the wire because if there weren't you sure as hell wouldn't be able to do what you do as a living(traveling around riding coasters). In fact the only reason your able to safely travel to other country's is because of people like me. I never said you don't know what your talking about because you probably do. I just saw people calling Americans wimps and I had to respond, being that it's technically my job. I had no idea the coasters industry was so stereotypical about Americans. Btw, that comment about me having a country to defend? I'm current on leave (vacation) and was planning to attend WCB but not anymore. I'll just sell my ticket and go do something better with my time. This is actually my brothers account but I thought I'd check out the site to see what's up being that riding rollercoasters is one of the only things I have to take my mind off the stressful environment I'm usually in. Thanks

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It is great that you serve for the United States and I have a lot of respect for that, but this is a theme park enthusiast board. People with experience in the theme park industry are telling you how it is. It is not a patriotic matter, it is the truth.

Edited by ernierocker
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I just saw people calling Americans wimps and I had to respond, being that it's technically my job.

 

Woooahhh what branch of the military is it that gets to go on internet message boards and call out people hatin' on Americans because I WANT IN.

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With all due respect Robb, you should be thankful that people like me are "obnoxious" enough to defend Americans to the wire because if there weren't you sure as hell wouldn't be able to do what you do as a living(traveling around riding coasters). In fact the only reason your able to safely travel to other country's is because of people like me. I never said you don't know what your talking about because you probably do. I just saw people calling Americans wimps and I had to respond, being that it's technically my job. I had no idea the coasters industry was so stereotypical about Americans. Btw, that comment about me having a country to defend? I'm current on leave (vacation) and was planning to attend WCB but not anymore. I'll just sell my ticket and go do something better with my time. This is actually my brothers account but I thought I'd check out the site to see what's up being that riding rollercoasters is one of the only things I have to take my mind off the stressful environment I'm usually in. Thanks

 

There's no need for hostility. Robb's view about "wimpyness" was just merely an unbiased observation about the way theme parks are operated in the US, and you took it way too personally. I don't understand how people get so angry and confrontational on this board. The arguing is getting old, so lets drop this, and carry on with being roller coaster nerds!

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