The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[NYTrojan]

Tatsu seldom uses that second station due to staffing.

 

I think they're getting better about that. The last time I went ot SFMM (a Sunday a few weekends back) they were running 2 trains with 2 stations on Tatsu.

[ebl]

As long as they don't use Tatsu's second station exclusively for Flash Pass holders, the line will move better IMO.

 

And on another note---I've said this before---if they want people to use the lockers, then get rid of the shelves in the loading area! During my last visit, I still saw people going over to put stuff on the shelves and run back to get locked into the train. That's where a lot of the time is going.

 

Eric

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

Tatsu seldom uses that second station due to staffing.

 

I think they're getting better about that. The last time I went ot SFMM (a Sunday a few weekends back) they were running 2 trains with 2 stations on Tatsu.

 

I've noticed tis as well, but the load side always needs two checking, which is rare. If yo only leave one on load side, then that person has to check the entire train and lock/unlock seats and open/ close queue gates. When I was there, that person also had to deal with flash pass as well. But at least they're trying so I'll give them a B+ for effort, and an A if it works in July & August.

[NYTrojan]

And on another note---I've said this before---if they want people to use the lockers, then get rid of the shelves in the loading area! During my last visit, I still saw people going over to put stuff on the shelves and run back to get locked into the train. That's where a lot of the time is going.

 

Eric

 

I Disagree. I've not seen a delay on Tatsu because people are taking too long to get back to their seats. I honestly don't ever remember a ride op waiting to check a set of restraints because someone took too long to walk 30 feet. I DO see delays on Tatsu because the computer reads one or two of the cars as not being properly secured, forcing the ride ops to reassess the car, unlatch, relatch everybody, etc etc. I also hate it when someone pulls the restraints too tight and needs a reset. I see even worse delays on rides like Scream when a heavy person gets in the wrong line because they don't mark the 'fat friendly' seats and they have to shuffle the whole train to try to accommodate. One set of "Hey big guy, try your luck here instead" signs would do more for dispatch time than lockers I guarantee it.

 

My opinion on the lockers is known and I don't want to turn this thread back in that direction, but you're always going to have something work its way to the station that won't ride, especially on a ride like Tatsu. Shoes, hats, and stuffed animals too big for lockers are just a few examples. The park can take a hard line on these things and really force you not to ride, and as much as some of you enthusiasts might love it, Joe Sixpack with his flip flop wearing family will turn their backs on a park so consumer aggressive. SFMM is in a position where they need to make nice to the gp who come into the park. They are trying to overcome some pretty serious negative publicity. Telling a 13 year old they can't ride because they made the mistake of taking their prize with them in line won't cut it. I especially like when someone takes a jacket or sweatshirt off and leaves it by the side of the train. Then ride ops tell them to go back and get it... you'll have to wear it, effectively doubling the time the person holds up the train. Remember, the GP is dumb. You can't hope to 'train' them. Far too many people come to theme parks to 'train' them in this manor. Expect this mistake over and over and over again. Last time I went EVERY train in Riddlers revenge suffered from this 'double' delay. There was always somebody with something that they had to be fetched.

[Jew]

^I think the point Eric was trying to make is that the shelves imply that the lockers are not needed at all. So someone with an item that HAS to go in the lockers will think they can still put it off to the side, which in turn causes more delays as the operators will have to take time to talk to that person. Your example of a sweater is exactly why Eric thinks they should remove the shelves.

[NYTrojan]

^I think the point Eric was trying to make is that the shelves imply that the lockers are not needed at all.

 

That's a fair point. I saw a sign on the shelves telling guests not to open them at all; to have a staff member handle the shelves. However, I do understand that those sorts of things tend to be ignored by the GP.

 

Still, Riddlers doesn't have any shelves and that's the one where I saw Ride Ops force riders to retrieve their gear. At Tatsu they pretty much let it go as there were so many hats and shoes it rarely made a difference.

[PURE]

I've never ridden X, so I can't speak from experience (only word of mouth), but why do I get this sinking suspision that the ride will inevitably still suck, and management has carefully considered a "plan B" of sorts featuring as many cosmetic distractions as possible? I'd like to think that with all the money spent, the new trains will indeed help the ride, but I just don't know. It just seems so odd to add all this other stuff. I realize it's mostly in place to market it as a different experience, but shouldn't a good ride stand up on it's own?

 

I know what you mean and with the past of MM's problems, when the previous plans for X2 got scrapped I was a little leery that they were having problems. However, I don't think the ride could possibly be any worse than it was when it closed. The ride is good, and it stands up on its own already, these additions are a way for the park to get away from the 'this ride is good enough, it doesn't need anything added' attitude. Although I guess you can't call it theming per se, they are doing things to enhance the ride beyond just being a coaster, and for that I applaud them.

 

For example, I am digging the flame throwers over the bottom of the first drop when you're on your back. To me that sounds freakin' awesome. Unlike anything on any other coaster, much less a 4D.

 

And in the article it says they're still shooting to still get fog and sound, which will add to the ride as well.

 

As for the operations of the rides, I think they can only do so much to inform the guests before they board the ride. Like mentioned earlier, parks like Disney and Universal have guests that are just as dumb, and they seem to dispatch rides very well.

 

In regards to Tatsu, when the ride is stacking or delayed I often see the ride understaffed. There are sometimes only 2 restraint checkers per side, per train, and the outside ops (the one on the side of the guest entrances) have to dispatch the train from the back of the station. So often, there is 1 op checking restraints on the left side of the train, and 1 on the right, who has to run back to the panel to make sure all cars are clear, and then has to run back to check the row of seats if they aren't. This alone causes a delay of the ride. On top of that the same ride op has to deal with Flashpasses. There's just too much to do, and not enough people to do it efficiently. When this is going on, you really can't blame the ride ops, you blame the ones who aren't giving the ride proper staffing to run efficiently.

 

On SB at Knotts which is inverted and much easier to load, we would have 4 ops, some times 6, checking the train at once to avoid blocking (2 for the first two rows, 2 for the next 3, and 2 for the last 3). I would think at least this many ops is necessary to avoid blocking on a flyer.

 

That said, when the ride is properly staffed and its still delaying or stacking, I'd say a majority of the time I'd blame the ride operators who are taking their sweet time, or who are off in their own mind instead of preparing the guests and themselves to load and dispatch the next train. At rides like Space Mountain at Disneyland, the ops are constantly talking to eachother or guests, rushing them on and off the trains as quickly as possible, bottom line, they know their job and what they must do, and they get it done.

 

Back in the mid nineties when I started getting on the bigger rides, I remember seeing Viper dispatch every 45 seconds to a minute, with 3 trains on the ride, never stacking. Those ops ran around to get the ride running like that, something I don't see happen at MM anymore.

[nagro5]

Back in the mid nineties when I started getting on the bigger rides, I remember seeing Viper dispatch every 45 seconds to a minute, with 3 trains on the ride, never stacking. Those ops ran around to get the ride running like that, something I don't see happen at MM anymore.

 

I'd have to to disagree. When I was there a couple months ago they were running three trains on Viper. The ride ops had the train in the station locked and ready to dispatch before the preceding train had reached the top yet. That's pretty dang fast if you ask me! When I was in line, they didn't stack once.

[robbalvey]

^ The crews ARE getting better...MUCH better. I have recently seen Viper crew hauling ass. Same thing with the Scream! crew. We were there the other day and watched the Scream! crew dispatch a train just after the other train hit the midcourse.

 

Great stuff!

 

--Robb

[trcg721]

I wish Viper could have 4 people at the ride at all times. Flashpass and the Elevator are the thing that slows us down the most. Last Saturday only having 3 people at the ride was a bit of a nightmare.

[PURE]

I'd have to to disagree. When I was there a couple months ago they were running three trains on Viper. The ride ops had the train in the station locked and ready to dispatch before the preceding train had reached the top yet. That's pretty dang fast if you ask me! When I was in line, they didn't stack once.

 

That's awesome to hear, lets hope they keep it up during the summer months, when it really counts. Also good to hear that about Scream. I have heard these are the easiest rides to maintain that type of operation (being as they are open stations and trains with easy sit down, one restraint check design), it would be nice to see the same type of operations begin to spread to the rest of the rides around the park.

 

For example, I think during the peak of the summer, there should be 3 train Goliath and Riddlers and 2 train Batman operation with no stacking. It's hard to do, but I think it would be great for the park to shoot for that, and it would also be very impressive. Especially because those are some of the more popular rides in the park.

 

Glad to hear operations are improving, and I hope it improves and stays that way for years to come.

[dj snow]

We were there the other day and watched the Scream! crew dispatch a train just after the other train hit the midcourse.

That's about as good as it gets. Although I will mention that I've been at Great Adventure's Medusa when they've dispatched trains with the train ahead still in the cobra roll. Now that is hauling!

 

I'll give SFMM midcourse brake, though. That's pretty darn good. And if I ever see a cobra roll dispatch, what the heck, I'll buy the crew a Coke.

[ebl]

"...Great Adventure's Medusa when they've dispatched trains with the train ahead still in the cobra roll." (dj snow)

 

In the cobra roll? I thought for safety reasons a train had to reach at least the brake before the next train could go out. That's the purpose of a block brake.

 

EDIT: Never mind...the lift can serve as a block, if I recall correctly.

 

Eric

[Mr.Six]

At Scream its very common for us to dispatch a train while the other one is going through the cobra roll.

 

^ Yeah , the lift acts as a VERY long block.

 

-Mike

[Gordon Freeman]

Heck, as soon as it drops off of the lift, you can dispatch the next train. Same goes with Tatsu too.

[Double0Kevin]

And on another note---I've said this before---if they want people to use the lockers, then get rid of the shelves in the loading area! During my last visit, I still saw people going over to put stuff on the shelves and run back to get locked into the train. That's where a lot of the time is going.

 

Eric

 

I agree with this, I was surprised to see that when i was down at MM last week. Up at SFDK we removed the cubbies at locker rides the day the lockers started to be used. That wasn't such an easy task at Medusa if anyone has ever seen those cubbies.

 

The guest get angry when you force them to put their loose items in these lockers and then reach the ride platform and see that there are cubbies to put their stuff in... but they can't use them. It's like giving away free candy that you have to pay for first.

[PURE]

At Scream its very common for us to dispatch a train while the other one is going through the cobra roll.

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm not saying things haven't changed in the past 2 months since I've been there, and maybe I'm just unlucky on every visit I've made to MM since Scream opened. So I'm saying this with as much sincerity and honesty possible (because when I post it often rubs the wrong way)...

 

I've never seen a train dispatch to lift while the one ahead of it is in the cobra roll, whether its 2 or 3 train operation. And I do pay attention to those kinds of things. Although it would be awesome to be there on the days it happens. I will say I've seen it consistently dispatch after the block brakes, and that's on days when things are moving right along, its very nice to be at the park on those days.

 

I'm not saying I don't believe it happens or that I don't believe you, I'm just saying it would be nice to be at the park on those days when the ride is operating running that efficient.

 

Also, there's a new X2 video up on the Magic Mountain homepage. Looks to be the promo video, one of the best promo videos I've ever seen for a ride. Awesome! Check it out!

 

www.sixflags.com/magicMountain/index.aspx

[robbalvey]

At Scream its very common for us to dispatch a train while the other one is going through the cobra roll.

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm not saying things haven't changed in the past 2 months since I've been there, and maybe I'm just unlucky on every visit I've made to MM since Scream opened. So I'm saying this with as much sincerity and honesty possible...

 

I've never seen a train dispatch to lift while the one ahead of it is in the cobra roll, whether its 2 or 3 train operation. And I do pay attention to those kinds of things. Although it would be awesome to be there on the days it happens. I will say I've seen it consistently dispatch after the block brakes, and that's on days when things are moving right along, its very nice to be at the park on those days.

PURE, I am going to try to say this as nice as possible....

 

Please, just stop posting here. While technically you haven't done anything wrong, anything against our ToS, it hurts to read what you have to write. It makes no sense. You take things out of context. And you just come off so rude and obnoxious to so many people.

 

I'm asking you nicely... just please stop posting here.

 

Thank you.

 

--Robb "I trust a Scream Leads personal experience." Alvey

[Mechanic]

That promo video is awesome. It reminds me a lot of the promo and commercial for the return of Disneyland's Space Mountain. Is it also a SFMM TV commercial in the local area? If it isn't, it should be.

 

On another note, are there any solid rumblings yet about what the 2009 coaster addition may be?

 

--Mech "Counting the days until we're back at SFMM in late June." anic

[NYTrojan]

Okay, here's a question I've been meaning to ask...

 

Am I the only one who doesn't get the colors used for the new X trains? The track is a pretty sweet charcoal and red... mean and menacing. The trains? Florida Gator Blue and Orange. How'd that happen?

[AllenA07]

I'm just thrilled it isn't purple and yellow anymore. I think the current colors look very nice! The trains should have some contrast from the rest of the ride.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

At Scream its very common for us to dispatch a train while the other one is going through the cobra roll.

 

^ Yeah , the lift acts as a VERY long block.

 

-Mike

 

It is the same with Riddler's. It says in the SOP that with two trains you're supposed to wait until it hits block brake, but the lift on both rides is 156 ft, so even you dispatch them one after the other, thats where it would be whne the next train clears lift anyway.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

I am so convinced the 2009 coaster is a GCI. It just seems logical for the park to go wood in 2009. They remove a woodie, they put one back in. Every other marjor park in the Six Flags chain has at LEAST two wooden coasters, and Six Flags St. Louis bought a GCI and park chains always buy rides in bulk. In addition to that, GCI's are family oriented, and have 48'' height requirements...I smell fabricated pine!

[wrs28330]

The next time you all come by Magic Mountain, you will be pleasantly surprised when you see Valencia Falls.

[ghost007jas]

Every time I have been to Magic Mountain, Vipers crew has always been one of the best. Whether this is motivation, pride in their ride, or it's just plainly easier to operate that ride has one hell of a crew. Keep up the great work guys!