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The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

Page 2228 - Wonder Woman Flight of Courage REAL POV!

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flash pass and fast lane was my savior last year on my trip to SFGAM, CP and King's Island. each have their different values depending on park but going somewhere i don't live near by, i'll always buy them.

 

sure, i think only allowing one or two rides on a new premier attraction sucks, but it is what it is.

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guess the "final ride" wasn't your final ride. lol. I'm in line too

 

Got to ride TC 15 minutes before closing for a total of 6 times today. Then rode Scream and went home. Today was the first time my girlfriend rode TC. She adores it. During my single rider rides, it was fun talking to people who never rode it before. I told them what to expect and they were all blown away by the ride.

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Flash Regular - Compare Six Flags' regular level Flash Pass to Disney's FastPass... They both do exactly the same thing, but Disney's is free and also available for all the major attractions. Six Flags' is about $40 and only available for certain rides (which tend to not have the longest lines anyways).

 

I stopped reading when I saw that.

 

Considering the full price of a single day ticket to ONE PARK at the Disneyland Resort is $99 when Six Flags is always running deals on gold passes that cost less than that for an entire year with parking and Hurricane Harbor (I got my gold pass during the Labor Day flash sale and pay the $6/month membership)...you can't compare the two in any way.

 

Also, FYI: You're still paying for FastPass. It's just built into the cost instead of being offered as an up-charge.

 

I have never used Flash Pass at SFMM since I live so close, but at the other SF parks I have used it at it has been worth every penny. I'm on vacation, and sometimes even have limited amount of time in each park. Having an insurance policy to maximize my ride time has been worth it every single time! The first time I used it at SFGADv, it wasn't even wireless yet---we had to use the stations to scan the Q-bot in front of each ride we wanted to ride. And it was still worth it even after the extra hassle.

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Potential flash pass (FP) users:

 

 

FP can be a great way to save time if:

 

-- It is a capacity day (4th of July and one or two other days during summer season, and many October afternoons and evenings during Freight Fest, after 3-4 P.M.)

-- It is a busy day (mid-to-late June through August and early September, some October afternoons and evenings during Freight Fest)

-- It's a moderate day and you'd like to turn 60 minute waits into 15-20 minutes each

 

FP is NOT a good idea if:

 

-- It's not busy.

-- You don't have the money.

 

As far as money's concerned, you may want to start a "trip account" for that one special day you plan to go. Who knows...you might only be in the area during, say, July 10th-July 12th. You can't come to the park except on the 11th--which happens to be a summer Saturday. The heat could easily be over 90 degrees, and the sun will beat down hard. It takes about 15 minutes to start burning. And you're with three others who are not tolerant. Without a flash pass (and without "fast feet" and good timing...), you will spend 5-6 extra HOURS in line. That's 20 rides for a quick person and 10-15 for the average person.

 

If you decide to stand in line, you'll have hot weather, line jumpers, foul language, and you'll be on your feet for 7-8 hours if you stay the whole day. After minute 90 for Goliath or Tatsu, you'll probably be thirsty and want to get a $5 water, and you'll probably wish you had saved for the pass.

 

The bottom line: please scope out the park and see if it's BUSY before heading to FP. You can get a FP any time, and if it's a ghost town, you will have saved lots by not buying one. Please have a look at our wait-time data and articles also. Compare "line-rot" day (Saturday, October 11th--a busy, bu not capacity, Freight Fest Saturday) to an off-peak day to get an idea of how much extra waiting you may do.

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Here's a breakdown of why I think the SF Flash Pass system is the worst value out there.

 

Flash Regular - Compare Six Flags' regular level Flash Pass to Disney's FastPass... They both do exactly the same thing, but Disney's is free and also available for all the major attractions. Six Flags' is about $40 and only available for certain rides (which tend to not have the longest lines anyways).

 

Flash Gold - If you want to have your wait times reduced, you have to pay more money for the Gold Flash Pass. This is somewhat comparable to Cedar Fair's Fast Lane, but with Cedar Fair, your wait time is only determined by how many others are in the Fast Lane line, not the regular line. If the regular line is an hour, but there are only a couple people in front of you, you can get on in 10 minutes with Fast Lane vs 30 minutes with Flash Gold. Depending which Cedar Fair park you're in (like KBF), there may be only one level of Fast Lane, which covers all the major attractions. Flash Gold covers most, but not all.

 

Flash Platinum - If you also want to go on the rides whose lines will be the longest (which is one of the main reasons for getting the thing in the first place), you have to then spend EVEN MORE for Platinum. Then, once you've spent well over $100 for your Flash Platinum, you have to pay ANOTHER FEE to be able to reserve a time on some attractions and/or only be allowed to use your reservation ability one time per day. Cedar Fair's Fast Lane Plus is 20-30% cheaper than Six Flag's Flash platinum, and there are no restrictions on how often you can use it, nor are there extra fees for specific rides.

 

Critically analyzing the relative value of similar products makes me entitled? This is interesting. Tell me more...

What you say about the wait times on the Gold FP leads me to believe that you've never actually used it. What sixflags.com says about the wait times and what wait times you encounter in reality are two very different things. The website says 50% of the standby wait time, but in my experience its nowhere near that. On days where every line was 1-2 hours my wait times with a gold pass were no more than 10-15 minutes for the "big" rides and 5 minutes or less or instantaneous for the less popular ones.

 

The Platinum pass is expensive, there's no getting around that fact. In the past I've completely dismissed it as a waste of money and always gone with the gold. Before YOLO was built, the only advantages were X2 reservations and double rides. If you didnt care about double rides and knew when the X2 line was shorter, you didnt need to pay for it. In the last few years, though, it's had more things added to it with YOLO and now Twisted Colossus being added, and Im not surprised Superman was tacked on too cause Flash pass with SEFK was often a bit of a cluster..the Flash Pass users were really messing up the standby queue on that ride. In the future I expect YOLO to eventually be dropped from the exclusives and probably TC in a couple years too depending on new additions. X2 will probably always be an upcharge.

 

I don't see it as Six Flags "only giving you some rides" for the regular flash pass. In general, the rides that are platinum only are rides that wouldnt otherwise be on the flash pass at all because they cant handle the extra volume for various reasons. At Six Flags they make it platinum only and/or platinum with reservation which greatly limits how many people use it. At Disney they just plain limit how many Fast Passes are available, and for something really popular like Radiator Springs Racers, all the Fast Passes can be gone right when the park opens. To say there are no restrictions or extra fees for specific rides at Cedar Fair is factually incorrect. That's what Fast Lane Plus is, an extra fee for specific rides, just like Six Flags' Flash Pass Platinum. You cant skip the line on GateKeeper or Maverick or Top Thrill Dragster (The most popular coasters at Cedar Fair) unless you buy the Plus pass for more money. CF's price is definitely better for these passes overall, certainly, yet I love the Q-Bot device that Six Flags uses, not having to physically wait in a line is a huge plus for me. At Cedar Point even the Fast Lane queues can be over an hour. So both are great for their own reasons.

 

To say that Disney gives you anything for free is naive. They may not charge you individually for the specific use of the Fast Pass, but look at the price of admission and everything else..you're paying for it, you just don't realize it. At Six Flags you pay $60 for a gold flash pass, but you only pay $40 or on some days $20 or $0 to get in. At DLR you dont pay for Fast Pass, but you pay $100 to get in the door. Personally Id prefer it if Disney charged less for admission and charged extra for Fast Lane, but I doubt theyre going to ever do that. Conversely if Six Flags announced Admission was going up to $100 but regular Flash Pass would now be free, how many people would prefer that? Probably not the people who had no intention of buying a Flash Pass.

 

Six Flags, Cedar Fair, and Disney all have their pros and cons as do their virtual queuing systems. I enjoy all of them for different reasons.

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To say there are no restrictions or extra fees for specific rides at Cedar Fair is factually incorrect. That's what Fast Lane Plus is, an extra fee for specific rides, just like Six Flags' Flash Pass Platinum. You cant skip the line on GateKeeper or Maverick or Top Thrill Dragster (The most popular coasters at Cedar Fair) unless you buy the Plus pass for more money.

 

Cedar Point upcharges you for the level change form regular to Plus to get 4 more coasters included, but doesn't then also charge you another fee on top of the upgrade for any specific rides, nor are there any restrictions for how often you can utilize your upgrade on those rides throughout the day. That's what sticks in my craw the most, at least with Magic Mountain's Flash Pass... I may be judging other SF parks to harshly by lumping them in with MM.

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But that is the thing…

 

Coming from a guy who has exclusively purchased the platinum flash pass for Six Flags every time we go, I think they value has actually gotten worse…

 

If it is your first time to the park and everything is equal and you actually want to ride all the rides, yes the flash pass is worth it… Except for the death glares you get when you take someones seat coming through the exit (I feel bad enough that I have never told my son about the double rides feature because I knew he he would want to go around again, that would mean twice the death stares)

 

But once you have gone a few times, at least in our experience, you KNOW the ones worth it and the ones not worth it… And as I was saying in my previous post, imo, only Superman, YOLO, TC, Tatsu, Goliath, and X2 are TRUELY worth the price…

 

I just wish they would let you customize the pass… Even paying 15 per reservation for X2 while ridiculous, at least gives you options… now putting superman on restriction and eliminating YOLO/TC options, I think makes the pass much worse…

 

Make an ultimate pass: $200: choose any 10 rides in the park, no restrictions (except double rides), that would be completely worth it and I think value wise, would be a MUCH better value than the crap going on with the Platinum pass now..

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I think what bugs me the most is that purchasing a Flash Pass would not be so necessary if the parks operations were better.

 

So the park gets a reward for terrible operations: they get to make more money by selling overpriced cut-the-line tickets to people who can't stand waiting. They get $30 for you to cut in line on 1 ride after you spend an additional $100 to get the pass.

 

Think about it, 1 train operations on major attractions makes for terrible capacity, which makes longer lines, which makes buying one a necessity if you're only at the park for a day and want to get on everything. Even on dead days lines that shouldn't be more than 20 minutes can be an hour. It's pretty ridiculous.

 

If Superman ran both sides, if Tatsu ran 3 trains with both stations, if Batman and Apocalypse had more than 1 train operations...the list goes on and on. If the park was run like Cedar Point and there was minimal stacking with more trains to get people through, I think the Flash Pass would be much less necessary.

 

Now I understand if you go on a Saturday in the Summer, the place is going to be packed anyway so there's not much they can do, and if you want to get on everything you just have to bite the bullet and pay, but I just feel like if the coasters operated the way they were meant to when initially put in the park, it wouldn't come down to having to buy a Flash Pass.

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There's nothing wrong with criticizing the flash pass or comparing it to an efficient system that actually works. Just because SFMM is cheaper than Disney doesnt mean their crappy implementation of a skipping the line program gets a pass.

 

Its all relevant. Pricing structures can vary, but at the end of the day, a good product is still a good product, and a shit one will still be shit

 

There's nothing entitled about it.

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If you do not think that a Flashpass is worth it, then do not pay for it. I know which parks that I visit often enough to the point of which I do never get it, and I know which parks that I rarely visit so that I will work for as many hours as I can so I can pay for it. When I am at a park like SFDK, I never buy it, even on the most crowded of days. But when I am at SFOT, a park that I have been to one time and will most likely not revisit within the next five years, the Platinum pass is worth every penny to me. And no, a regular Flashpass does not work the same way as Disney Fastpass. Disney Fastpass is based purely on a supply/demand system, so it is not uncommon to have a return time of no sooner than five hours later for a ride with a one hour wait. It can be an effective system, but it does require some pre-planning of your day. For this reason, I often do not even like to use that many Fastpasses at Disneyland, even when it is fairly crowded. (Usually, I will only use Fastpass once or twice in the span of a 16 hour operating day).

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There's nothing wrong with criticizing the flash pass or comparing it to an efficient system that actually works. Just because SFMM is cheaper than Disney doesnt mean their crappy implementation of a skipping the line program gets a pass.

 

Its all relevant. Pricing structures can vary, but at the end of the day, a good product is still a good product, and a poo-poo one will still be poo-poo

 

There's nothing entitled about it.

 

With the price I'm paying for my pass ($6/month), I can buy a gold FlashPass for less than a 1 day, 1 park ticket to Disneyland or DCA. So pricing does play a role, since perceived value is most definitely part of the equation. You could even argue that in some ways FlashPass is more convenient, since you can reserve rides how you want them instead of having to rush over to get a FastPass for whatever time is available. Current pricing is so cheap for the FlashPass that Six Flags really doesn't have any choice but to make the popular rides up-charges or Platinum only unless they got rid of the lower priced options completely. Otherwise the FlashPass lines would be long and slow the standby lines down even more.

 

The reality is there is no such thing as a perfect line holding/skipping product. Each will have their own strengths and weaknesses and everyone will have a different perceived value of them.

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Well said Jew.

 

I guess what you're saying is you get what you pay for.

 

Sure, it's crappy service, but it's dirt cheap.

 

For Season Pass Holders.

 

However a fresh visitor with his wife, kids, and 1-2 teens might not find the value quite as amusing. Say especially, for a family which has never come to the park before.

 

Or is the park done with targeting families?

 

Either way from a economical standpoint, or an operating standpoint, Six Flags Magic Mountain is doing it wrong.

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Well said Jew.

 

I guess what you're saying is you get what you pay for.

 

Sure, it's crappy service, but it's dirt cheap.

 

For Season Pass Holders.

 

However a fresh visitor with his wife, kids, and 1-2 teens might not find the value quite as amusing. Say especially, for a family which has never come to the park before.

 

Or is the park done with targeting families?

 

Either way from a economical standpoint, or an operating standpoint, Six Flags Magic Mountain is doing it wrong.

When did they start targeting families, when have they ever? MM targets young people who go to the park with other young people friends. With KBF, DLR, and USH already competing for the Southern California family amusement park dollar, I actually think it's smart of them.

I don't think the Six Flags Flash Pass is a crappy product, either. I've used it on just about every visit to SFMM and I've been happy with it all but once. The only time I was disappointed was when I finally decided to visit during Fright Fest and found that the FF mazes were loaded onto the Flash Pass. That was unfortunate because it can apparently only hold so many attractions (or MM will only allow so many I don't know which) so there were several coasters normally on the Flash Pass that werent on it that day due to making room for the mazes. That was a few years ago though and that doesn't happen anymore because they now have a separate system for FF mazes.

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Regarding line cutting, will the MM staff actually do anything if I tell them that some people cut in line? Or are the signs that "line cutters will be ejected from the park" just bull crap?

 

Three guys from a high school swim team field trip cut the X2 line the other day to join their buddies. I should had found their chaparone.

 

This is another advantage of single rider line. I have never seen anyone cut a single rider line.

Edited by mike932
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Regarding line cutting, will the MM staff actually do anything if I tell them that some people cut in line? Or are the signs that "line cutters will be ejected from the park" just bull crap?

Usually the latter, and not just at MM. Most parks don't do anything unless it's egregious.

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Regarding line cutting, will the MM staff actually do anything if I tell them that some people cut in line? Or are the signs that "line cutters will be ejected from the park" just bull crap?

Usually the latter, and not just at MM. Most parks don't do anything unless it's egregious.

 

Its far worse at SFMM than any other park I have been to.

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Regarding line cutting, will the MM staff actually do anything if I tell them that some people cut in line? Or are the signs that "line cutters will be ejected from the park" just bull crap?

Usually the latter, and not just at MM. Most parks don't do anything unless it's egregious.

 

Its far worse at SFMM than any other park I have been to.

 

No joke, on Thursday May 28th, we were in line for TC at about 7:45, and these two teenagers literally cut the line IN FRONT OF A "SECURITY" guard… a literally watched them hop over two separate rails, and did not say jack…

 

I am not really someone who gets too pissed about these kinds of things so it really didn't bother me, but I found it hilarious how little they actually did to stop it...

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Sign at Six Flags Magic Mountain:

 

"Line jumpers will be removed from part without refund!

Unless you give us $40. Heck, you could give us $100 and we will even help you.

Walk you to the front row and snatch it from others; we will, serial!"

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The NEW Kentucky Kingdom had the worst line cutting I have ever seen. SFMM is Disney by comparison.

The crowds at KK are obnoxious, far worse than any other park I've been to.

 

But yeah, Flash Passes really aren't cheap, but they're a "luxury" item. If you don't want to pay for a Flash Pass, go to the park on a day that will have smaller crowds. Problem solved!

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The NEW Kentucky Kingdom had the worst line cutting I have ever seen. SFMM is Disney by comparison.

The crowds at KK are obnoxious, far worse than any other park I've been to.

 

But yeah, Flash Passes really aren't cheap, but they're a "luxury" item. If you don't want to pay for a Flash Pass, go to the park on a day that will have smaller crowds. Problem solved!

Exactly! I can understand complaints about parking rates, food, admission etc; because those are necessary things at an amusement park. Flashpasses aren't necessary, plus if they were cheaper more people would buy them and it wouldnt be much of an advantage

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I think we are all missing the biggest news, perhaps even eclipsing TC...

 

They're actually working on Swashbuckler!!!!

 

Could it actually open sometime this year? Discuss.

How long has this been down? I haven't been there in about a year and it was down then. I like this ride on a crowed day as it's something to do with a short line. It's actually pretty cool at night.

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