The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[PeoplemoverMatt]

However, like most things with the park, I'd wager it'll stay the same and that audio box will just be a memory, and a waste of space for years to come. And herein lies one of the many differences in quality between SF and Disney: no motivation or desire to uphold the standards of the original product. Sad, really.

 

Seriously? The park has gone through an amazing turnaround, is now impressing everyone in multiple areas, and just because the audio hasn't worked for a while it's all back to how SF just gives up & has no motivation/desire to uphold standards??? Quite the unfair statement, IMO.

[DBJ]

To be fair to SFMM, I've seen plenty of effects over the years at Disney and Universal that go unrepaired. I generally find myself to more critical of Disney when it comes to the upkeep simply because they do have the money, unlike SF. SF has been in near bankruptcy for how long now? And SFMM still managed to improve over the years since the management shift. Not everything works out for them 100% of the time, but I am glad they are trying even with their limited resources.

[austinlee]

^^ I think that statement is unfair too.

 

^^^ I prefer the back on many coasters too, including Terminator, for the same reasons you mentioned, although I have found that on Terminator, other than row 11, I get the most airtime in row 8. In theory I agree with your idea to put seats in row 12, but realistically it seems like a lot of effort just to have a negligible effect on capacity.

[ebl]

Terminator's capacity would improve with better control/handling of people going through the pre-shows. I've already said this, but I think spacing out the pre-shows a little more, and moving them back (earlier in the queue), say, ten minutes' worth of waiting would allow for the necessary backlog at boarding to assure full trains.

 

In my opinion, adding a twelfth car to each train would do little but add confusion to a station that honestly is a bit too small. From what I've heard, this is GCII's standard size station, but other GCII rides don't have pre-shows that affect the continuous flow of guests going into the station. This is one time where, perhaps, a custom design might have worked better.

 

At WCB, the single-rider line was brought up, and was said to be something in development at that time. That also is a good way to fill trains and move people. I did find it interesting that this is being considered, since it could cut into sales of the Flash Pass system. But we'll see how that works out.

 

Eric

Edited April 18, 2010 by ebl

[Jew]

However, like most things with the park, I'd wager it'll stay the same and that audio box will just be a memory, and a waste of space for years to come. And herein lies one of the many differences in quality between SF and Disney: no motivation or desire to uphold the standards of the original product. Sad, really.

 

Seriously? The park has gone through an amazing turnaround, is now impressing everyone in multiple areas, and just because the audio hasn't worked for a while it's all back to how SF just gives up & has no motivation/desire to uphold standards??? Quite the unfair statement, IMO.

 

I don't think it is totally unfounded. Terminator is the parks newest major attraction, and their first attempt at real themeing on a major attraction. It's not a stretch to think that the park would want to maintain it, and that the fact they are unable to might be a telling sign that things are not really changing in the long run.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

^But when you really have no idea why the audio hasn't worked, it's a giant, and IMO unfair, assumption to say that the audio hasn't worked because "SF has no motivation or desire to uphold the standards of the original product."

 

That kind of assumption flies directly in the face of everything that SFMM has done & is doing to improve the park, and I believe their track record over the past few years is proof that things have indeed changed big time for the better.

 

Just because you may not know the reason for the audio difficulties doesn't mean they're intentionally not fixing it. I'm sure there was a cause for the problem, there's a reason why it hasn't been on in a while, and that we'll all learn the story behind the difficulties at some point in the future once the situation has been resolved one way or the other.

[SharkTums]

^Yeah, but you're being a bit unfair cause you work for the park and sound like you're just sucking up.

 

Like the discussion we're having in the Universal Singapore thread, no matter what part of the ride is broken or having issues, it comes down to the person in charge to fix it or get rid of it.

 

If Six Flags does not fix the audio, then it's no ones fault other than theirs no matter how crappy the audio they purchased might be!

[Jew]

^^From the perspective of the guest, all we see is audio that has been out for awhile. In a park that has lost just about all of the extra effects on the rides that had them. So I don't really think it's a stretch at all to think, "great, here we go again."

 

Have some things improved? Sure. But when it comes to themeing, what has the park done besides get the "batfan" effect working again that would make everyone think it's a sure bet the audio will return? There's a lot of things that are probably far less expensive than fixing on-board audio (Riddlers neon, fog in S:TE/B:TR stations, proper station lighting on B:TR like it used to be, maybe even the A/C in S:TE's queues) that have yet to be restored.

 

Or better yet, when is the last time the park has had all their rides running at maximum capacity? How is the park to be expected to fix the audio problems when they can't even keep all their other coaster trains in service?

Edited April 19, 2010 by Jew

[MagicMountainMan]

Yeah I wouldn't say that SFMM has really reached it's full "potential" either. Like Joey said there are plenty of things that can still be fixed. Oh and speaking of fog in Batman's station, is that what those random pipes are for in between the brake block (transfer break) and the actual station? I've always wondered what they are for....

[austinlee]

Anything to ensure that full trains go out on Terminator when it has a line would be a big improvement. I also wish they would start letting people skip the pre-show when the ride is a walk on again, like they used to. I would love to see the single rider lines brought back to some of the coasters when used to have them (Viper, Riddler, Deja Vu), and hopefully some which never did too. I was disappointed when the single rider lines were removed since I used to use them all the time. Especially on Deja Vu. I skipped many lines which were an hour or more that way. I agree with Eric that it is interesting that they are considering bringing the single rider lines back now that they have Flash Pass, but I would be very happy to see them return.

 

^^ The park was essentially at full capacity when I was there on Friday, except for Ninja being closed. They had two trains on every other coaster, even Gold Rusher. They were only running one side of Superman but if I recall correctly, they are unable to run both sides at the same time? The A/C's in Supermans queue have been on every time I've been there in the last 3 years too, except for some visits when it was cold and the A/C was not needed.

[Jew]

^Two trains isn't full capacity for Goliath, RRv, Viper, or Goldrusher. Even under the old management when I worked there from 2001-2003, those rides ran 3 trains. Nor I have I felt the A/C working in visits over the last 3 years (probably due to the fact that unless things have changed, SFMM only pays for an HVAC technician in the morning.)

[gforce532]

Does Riddler, Viper, or Goldrusher ever run 3 trains anymore? Because it has been a while since Ive seen them run a 3 train op. BTW that A/C on superman during july and august makes me give superman my vote for one of the best lines ever. It always worked whenever Ive been on it recently.

[austinlee]

^^ Ok. I usually visit the park on low crowd days. I have actually never seen them run more than two trains on any coaster on any visit, except when I rode Viper on its opening weekend. In my opinion two trains are great on a day when lines are very short and they don't really need more than that. They probably only needed one train on many coasters on Friday. Numerous trains were going out with less than 10 people on them.

 

^ I love the A/C in Supermans queue on those sauna like days in July and August too.

[atem122]

^^^Within the last year (or maybe a bit more), I've seen at least Viper and Goliath running with all three trains. I forgot how crowded it was though, but it has been done recently!

[PAL]

^I saw three train operation on Viper on a Saturday just prior to Halloween last year. The ops were cranking them out. It was cool to see.

[WFChris]

As far as the pre-show goes, I think they should just add a few queue zig zags in there and just extend the line through it. I don't really see people paying much attention to it anyway. Who cares if it cycles through more than once, if the ride runs efficiently, it shouldn't happen.

Edited April 19, 2010 by WFChris

[AWill961]

^ I think I may have seen them run 3 trains on Viper before... though I cannot quite recall.

 

Other than that, I always see them running 3 trains for Goliath in the summer (July and early August).

[austinlee]

It's nice to know they are still running three trains when necessary on some of the other coasters. I didn't know if they still did this or not. The only coaster I have seen them run three trains on recently was Tatsu, using both stations, during Summer Break last year and also New Years Eve, 2006. When I was there last July and August all coasters which are able to were running two trains, except for Tatsu which was running three.

[gforce532]

For viper and riddler - 3 trains + kickass crew = one fast moving line. I have only seen tatsu and goliath run 3 trains at once in recent memory, though goliath I have not seen for a couple of years. It seems whenever goliath did there would be a horrible crew working those day. Which at times there will be 2 trains waiting on the brakerun before the other trains is ready to leave the station. That pretty much defeats the purpose of the multiple train operation.

 

In regards to terminator's pre-shows, I think they should just let the line go through those builings rather than stoping it in every room and just let the videos run on replay. They wouldn't need to have the employees in there except for the flash pass merge. And you can skip it on those empty days.

[ebl]

Sometimes, running three trains is pointless if they stack. And that's the case at Riddler's Revenge to be sure because of how slow the load process is. Running three trains on Tatsu is good, provided both stations are open. Three trains on Viper works if the crew hustles. Three trains on X2 (I've seen it) is pretty much nothing but stacked trains---on that ride, running two works better. Three on Scream! will also stack nicely, thank you. If the crew hustles, three on Ninja can work well.

 

I'm old enough to remember four-and five-train operation on Revolution, and at least three-train operation on Gold Rusher. Colossus was originally designed to run five trains on each track! I don't think they ever did that---at least not effectively. And that was before any block brakes were added.

 

Eric

[gforce532]

I'm old enough to remember four-and five-train operation on Revolution

 

Heck from this photo I count a least 6 and there is still a line extending out of the entrance. http://www.rcdb.com/130.htm?p=5485

 

BTW does revoultion only have 2 total trains or is one backstage for rehab.

[rcdude]

I've seen:

 

Two trains on Gold Rusher (no stacking)

Two trains on Revolution (no stacking)

Three trains on Colossus (minimal stacking)

Two trains on Ninja (no stacking)

Three trains on Viper (minimal stacking)

Two trains on Batman (minimal stacking)

Three trains on Riddler's (stacking)

Three trains on Goliath (stacking)

Three trains on X2 (heavy stacking)

Three trains on Scream (minimal stacking)

Three trains on Tatsu (minimal stacking with both stations)

Two trains on Terminator (no stacking)

 

All in the past three years. It seems like everything at the park runs better with two trains because they can usually avoid stacking on anything with only two (except Batman due to it being so short). I don't know what a good dispatch interval is for most roller coasters, but I would think it might be something like a minute for real simple restraint systems (lap bar or shoulder harness with no belt), 90 seconds for most rides, and two minutes for rides like X2 or Riddler's Revenge that have more complex loading procedures.

[austinlee]

^^^^ I agree with your idea for Terminator.

 

^^^ This is why I'm pretty happy with having two trains on everything when the park is busy. In my experience the lines move very well when there are two trains running. A third would just stack most of the time which wouldn't make the lines move faster. When they had three trains on Tatsu and both stations open the line was almost constantly moving. When I first started going to the park (first visit was in 1983) I remember them running three trains on each track on Colossus and the line still went up that hill passed what is now Ben & Jerry's.

[xXRocketManXx]

Today was terrible, took one hour just to go on Déjà vu and every other ride was 30 minutes+. Haven't been to Magic Mountain since last year, but I don't remember this many people! And, I didn't go on Terminator but I swear I heard sound coming from those speakers while it was going up the lift.

 

Special event eh? I noticed a lot of people with big red stickers on them...

Edited April 19, 2010 by xXRocketManXx

[austinlee]

Sorry it was that crowded but the park had two special events today. I hope you're right about having sound on Terminator. That would be very welcome news.