The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[pǝʇɹǝʌuı]

I'm glad SFMM has Goliath over not having a hyper at all. It's a unique ride and extremely smooth, but nothing to write home about. It fills a necessary spot in the park's lineup but that's about it. I much prefer hypers from B&M or Intamin, but California has a disappointing lack of any coasters of that type, which is probably why the GP loves it so much (it's always one of the longest waits at the park). It's a fun ride with some unique elements, my personal favorite of which is the camelback, which has such clean floater airtime that you really feel weightless for a solid 5-6 seconds. As has been mentioned the helix is also very intense. The drop is the real disappointment here, as that's the element I normally look forward to most in a hyper. Again, good ride, but not great. It's fun and I could literally ride it all day, but it's certainly not a standout among hyper coasters.

[coasterbill]

my personal favorite of which is the camelback, which has such clean floater airtime that you really feel weightless for a solid 5-6 seconds

 

I agree. I didn't remember that element making much of an impression but I loved it this last visit. Maybe it was just a case of nonexistant expectations but Goliath was the sleeper hit of the day.

[xVicesAndVirtues]

I've never ridden either coaster but I know both have similar layouts so why is Titan such a big step down from Goliath?

 

It's really intense, but not in a cool way... it's sort of like "gravitron intense" where it makes you feel like you're going to die but not by doing anything interesting, it just spins you around in circles so there's no payoff. I don't mind grey-out inducing elements if they're fun and do cool sh*t like I305 but that first helix is brutal and you don't recover from it by the second one so it's basically like you can't see straight for 45 seconds or so but all you're doing is going around in circles. Then again, it was 105 degrees when we rode it so it's likely that it's not always running that fast and we were probably really dehydrated.

 

I love intensity but not when it's just endless helixes for no reason. With I305 and Maverick the ride is also doing amazing sh*t while performing super intense maneuvers which is great. Titan is not doing that. Goliath pulls out of the helix at the perfect time. It's actually a really cool element on that ride.

 

I'm sure some people love Titan and I get why. It's just not for me.

 

Second that. I thought the exact same thing on Titan, and it was also about 100 degrees out and my brain was sticking to the inside of my skull from dehydration and seemed to be permanently stuck to one side while I couldn't see, which hurt. Also, Titan seemed to have an odd wheel vibration that was just generally unpleasant. I think Goliath is really boring but at least generally smoother/more pleasant. It also wastes that huge drop's worth of speed on an element and a half then (thankfully) crawls through the rest after the brake run.

[Arthur_Seaton]

Ok some random question, but I'd like to hear some opinions on Goliath (and/or the other Giovanalo hyper for that matter, if you've ridden it.)

I've loved Goliath since the year it opened and ride it over and over when I visit, yet I could only do Titan a couple of times. The reason for disliking Titan is the same as what others have mentioned here: the additional helix. Goliath's helix is already a bit much, but at least it's at the end of the ride. But also, when I rode it, Titan was notably rougher — especially at the bottom of the first drop. I've never known Goliath be anything other than glass-smooth at any time.

 

I think it comes down to personal preference. If non-stop thigh-smashing twisty disorientation (RMC / Skyrush) is your thing, you'll most likely find Goliath boring. But if you dig big, protracted elements, a sense of speed, and less-aggressive airtime (think B&M hypers), you'll dig it. It's a great-looking coaster — especially from the parking lot, where the drop looks seriously intimidating. As others have mentioned, the drop rides more like a steep ramp, but combine it with the height and the smoothness, and you have an enjoyable ride rather than one that's preoccupied with being the most-intense bucking-bronco type thing ever. Fantastic ride that's easy to marathon (on a slow day, obviously).

 

EDIT (playing catchup-in the thread): THRILLED to see that Green Lantern is leaving. It's by far the worst ride I've ever ridden anywhere.

[thrillseeker4552]

Hey, isn't Magic Mountain opening a new coaster this year lol? Or are they pushing it to 2020 now instead because nobody seems to care?!?

 

To be honest, I have forgotten SFMM is building a new coaster like 5 times now. The fact that Copperhead has been open for a week, Yukon Striker has been testing, Steel Curtain is nearing the end of construction, Maxx Force has lots of track and columns up already, and West Coast Racers is JUST starting on foundations makes it easy to forget about.

 

...and Six Flags Magic Mountain is one of my home parks. I went in December and March and literally didn't even care about stalking the construction because it was all dirt. I forgot it was even happening. Hopefully it opens this year! lol

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Well someone at SFMM still remembers when they used to open their new coasters in March. They made mention of Batman's recent birthday on their social media. Batman, of course, came along in the pre-Xtreme park years when SFMM still cared about theming and having a new coaster open for the busy Spring Break season.

[Jew]

Well someone at SFMM still remembers when they used to open their new coasters in March. They made mention of Batman's recent birthday on their social media. Batman, of course, came along in the pre-Xtreme park years when SFMM still cared about theming and having a new coaster open for the busy Spring Break season.

 

Time Warner was a great owner for Six Flags.

[CoasterGuy06]

The SFOG limited partners would disagree about Time Warner. Of course, they got several hundred million for their troubles.

[RAWKIN_coaster38]

Personally, Goliath just doesn't do a lot for me. I agree that I would take almost any hyper over it.

 

However, the GP LOVE it, so I guess that's really all that matters? It's not going anywhere any time soon.

 

However, I hate hate hate the midcourse brake. It didn't used to stop as drastically as it does now but if you're not paying attention you can really get thrown forward... like a car wreck. Then it just slowwllyyy turns down into the helix and it's a very awkward feeling. I remember Raging Bull doing something like that too.

 

I do like the helix, though the forces are too much for some people, and too much if you have a headache or are dehydrated. I still love to yell "HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX HELIX!!" Also, there are tricks to avoid gray-out, or gray yourself out more if you want. It's definitely one of the more forceful helices I have been on.

[Intamin_coyote]

 

Consider the period of time when Goliath was built: you look at the 200 foot Intamin Supermans that were being made at SFNE, SFA, SFDL, during the exact same time period, and have infinitely better reviews. I kinda wish Magic Mountain would have done one of those with Intamin, painted it the same orange and teal, named it Goliath and called it a day.

 

But for some ungodly reason the general public absolutely loves Goliath to this day. Maybe it's because of that tall looming intimidating drop you can see from the parking lot. The big faux-rock entrance. I have friends that will ride X2 anyday, but for some reason Goliath freaks them out. They hate that lift hill. That drop freaks them out.

 

It makes no sense to me. I've probably been skipping Goliath on my trips for about a decade now. The queue line is just way too long even if it's walk on, and I would rather get on Batman or Twisted Colossus an extra time or two instead.

 

 

Really? "It makes no sense" to you?

 

What you have to remember is that the vast majority of the public does not have the breadth of experiences that you or the typical enthusiast has. So yes, it is that "tall looming intimidating drop" that frightens/thrills them. They do not know about or care for the Superman hypers found all the way on the opposite coast. To my knowledge, there aren't even any B&M hypers in SFMM's proximity either or really anywhere on the west coast.

 

To them, it is THE "big and bad" coaster. And it seems to me, that the GP more than anything else, is drawn by height/drop - and Goliath is the tallest continuous circuit coaster in CA - by a wide margin.

 

They're not concerned with all the little nuances that enthusiasts harp on and obsess about. They're not paying attention to how the angle of the first drop is "only" 61 degrees. Or whether a ride has "too little airtime" or "not enough force".

 

I get this reality check every time I go to CP with my friends, and they are absolutely perplexed at how I prefer Maverick to MF or TTD.

 

"But its only like 80 ft high!" They say (FTR, they still like Maverick, just not nearly as much as MF or TTD).

 

And thats fine if they feel that way. To each their own, and as RAWKIN says, if the GP like it that IS all that really matters from the park's business standpoint. (hardcore enthusiasts are a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percent of the park's attendance)

 

But just one question...

 

How long of a que are we talking here. Like Bat at KI bad or???

[RoxasBraveheart]

They're not concerned with all the little nuances that enthusiasts harp on and obsess about. They're not paying attention to how the angle of the first drop is "only" 61 degrees. Or whether a ride has "too little airtime" or "not enough force".

I think we've all had that reality check before. I mean, seriously, how can someone like something like Goliath? Then again, as I say that, I know a lot of my GP friends love it.

How long of a que are we talking here. Like Bat at KI bad or???

You have no idea.

[Jew]

The SFOG limited partners would disagree about Time Warner. Of course, they got several hundred million for their troubles.

 

Well, for the parks they owned at least.

 

Magic Mountain had themed uniforms, better employee cafeteria, much cleaner, kept effects working...

 

All the "old timers" who worked during that era will say it's the favorite owner.

[ryder]

It's easy to forget, but when Goliath first opened in 2000, it was, for a brief moment, the tallest coaster in the world at 235ft (with the drop being 255ft since it goes below ground level). It opened about 2-3 months before Millennium Force took that title away.

 

Even so, with the exception of Superman (which many view as a one trick pony, not a true coaster), it's still the tallest coaster on the West Coast to this day. I believe you have to get to Texas for Titan before you get anything taller.

[Superbatboy]

I've always loved Goliath, after all these years it's still the smoothest ride in the park. Titan was the exact opposite, very rough. It's odd when pretty much exact clones can have such different ride experiences. The same with Scream and Bizzaro, Scream rides like absolute trash while Bizarro is an absolute joy.

[pǝʇɹǝʌuı]

Even so, with the exception of Superman (which many view as a one trick pony, not a true coaster), it's still the tallest coaster on the West Coast to this day. I believe you have to get to Texas for Titan before you get anything taller.

 

This.

 

I live about 8 hours from SFMM and Goliath is the only real hyper anywhere close (yes, Cannibal is 200ft tall and a great ride but not really a hyper stylistically). Hopefully Mako will round out the area more when it opens. It's not a hyper but should have a great first drop!

 

Scream rides like absolute trash while Bizarro is an absolute joy.

 

This is so true. I was totally expecting Scream and was very pleasantly surprised. But I digress...

[ytterbiumanalyst]

I loved Goliath, second best ride in the park after Colossus. That queue is long but also really cool. With all the bamboo insulating you from the rest of the park, you really get lost in another world. That's the point of theme parks, and for once, Six Flags succeeded on that goal.

[thedlr]

I actually used to enjoy Goliath. I still enjoy the first half. The second half just gives me nausea now. I'm getting old.

[Twistedtatsu805]

Question: I upgraded to diamond a few months ago, but I never really use any of the diamond benefits. Do they allow you to downgrade?

[ryder]

When you bought that membership, you agreed to a contract that you'd remain at the level for a certain time period (probably a year). While you will have to read your own fine print, probably not until your year is up.

[coasternut]

I'm glad to report that finally I see some work being done on WCR - West Coast Racers. Lots of footers being dug and cement being poured. They're even doing work to the Apocalypse track too! That's a surprise.

Even some ride parts are being delivered for WCR. Finally, something is happening...

[powpig]

I live about 8 hours from SFMM and Goliath is the only real hyper anywhere close (yes, Cannibal is 200ft tall and a great ride but not really a hyper stylistically). Hopefully Mako will round out the area more when it opens. It's not a hyper but should have a great first drop!

 

No love for Desperado? Way closer than Cannibal.

[pǝʇɹǝʌuı]

I live about 8 hours from SFMM and Goliath is the only real hyper anywhere close (yes, Cannibal is 200ft tall and a great ride but not really a hyper stylistically). Hopefully Mako will round out the area more when it opens. It's not a hyper but should have a great first drop!

 

No love for Desperado? Way closer than Cannibal.

 

Should've clarified that I live closer to Cannibal. My bad.

 

The irony is that I have to drive past Desperado every time I go to Southern California, and have yet to ride it (which is probably why I totally forgot it existed). I always check to see if it's open before I pass through Primm and every single time it's been closed. So yeah, it's technically closer to me than Goliath, blah, blah, I messed up, whatever. I'd probably like it since I'm a fan of Magnum, it's just not worth the trip to the middle of nowhere for me since I'm hardly ever traveling with other coaster nerds. Maybe one day I'll make a Vegas trip and tag it on.

 

but only if the winds aren't too bad...in Primm NV...

[ryder]

[quote="powpig"

 

No love for Desperado? Way closer than Cannibal.

 

Not in its current condition... when it does run anymore, it’s pretty rough. Although it essentially is currently SBNO. So no, it doesn’t count at all a time the moment.

[SteVeUrkle]

The irony is that I have to drive past Desperado every time I go to Southern California, and have yet to ride it (which is probably why I totally forgot it existed).....I'd probably like it since I'm a fan of Magnum...

 

I got lucky and got to ride Desperado 1 time happened to be driving to Vegas during the day which is VERY rare for me.

 

I'd say Desperado is significantly rougher which I think is caused by lack of roller coaster maintenance staff experience (however my last ride on Magnum in 2018, man, that thing slammed me around like never before). But like Magnum it's really got some of those "hard hitting" moments where you can literally feel the train slamming into the elements because they're just so harsh. Some of the air hills on Desperado are shaped like a pyramid I don't know who thought that was a good idea for comfort but still, it was an experience, that's for sure. I'd suggest riding it at least once!

 

Fun fact: Desperado has a taller lift hill (209ft vs 205ft), and longer drop (225ft vs 205ft) than Magnum.

 

I'm glad SFMM has Goliath over not having a hyper at all.

 

Well duhhh...

 

How long of a que are we talking here. Like Bat at KI bad or???

 

I'd say it's on par with Bat at KI. It looks pretty straightforward on paper, but it is definitely quite a distance. There are some switchbacks before the long straight queue along the Goliath break run that you can't really get around unless you want to start hoping or ducking poles, and I'm just not about that anymore. And if the chains are being used there's 2 sets of long switchbacks before you get under Goliath's pre-lift turnaround. Not only that there's 2 sets of very long tall stairs, one right after the other, as Goliath is something like 20-30 feet off the ground in the station. Unless I'm really in the coaster loving mood, just not worth it for me to get on a mundayne ride.

[Intamin_coyote]

Ok some random question, but I'd like to hear some opinions on Goliath (and/or the other Giovanalo hyper for that matter, if you've ridden it.)

 

I think it comes down to personal preference. If non-stop thigh-smashing twisty disorientation (RMC / Skyrush) is your thing, you'll most likely find Goliath boring. But if you dig big, protracted elements, a sense of speed, and less-aggressive airtime (think B&M hypers), you'll dig it.

 

I guess you could say I don't have necessarily have a preference but like to view every ride as being unique and special in its own way - and having something different to bring to the table.

 

For example, I just can't help but to my rolls my eyes at the tiresome and beat-to-death "Millennium Forceless" trope anymore (honestly, the dead horse had been beaten long ago; its since been fed in to a meat grinder, incinerated, and repurposed as spiringtime fertilizer. I've also never found it all that clever to begin with, nor funny!)

 

Sure, its not the most intense ride, but isn't that what Maverick, TTD, and now SV are for?

 

And for the context of when Millie was designed, I would imagine they weren't concerned about putting a ton of airtime on it, considering the former marquee attraction (Magnum) had no shortage of it. (Not to mention how challenging it is to fit the world's first giga into the footprint they did - that was a feat alone, I can't imagine they worried themselves about what hardcore enthusiasts decades later on internet forums would gripe about it being "forceless")

 

They wanted something very different from Magnum - something the world had never seen before, and that they got.

 

This is similiar to why the Beast is designed the way it is (not much airtime, terrain-hugging etc.). They didn't want what some would view as just a "bigger Racer". (And this was a risky project as well, much more risky than MF I would say).

 

Truth is, Millennium Force doesn't need neck-snapping lateral-Gs or thigh-murdering ejector airtime to be one of the best coasters...

 

Its thrill is derived from absolutely hauling ass all the way through its course, so much so that even after well over 6000 ft of track, it still has gravy enough to scare the ever-living shit out of unsuspecting guests (particularly by the unloading station), as it goes into its last overbank.

 

Or at least, thats my 2cents on Mill Force...