The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[Tmcdllr]

One of Anton's great innovations I believe was blocking. When it opened there were already several blocks and block brakes in place. This is how it was able to run 5 trains safely. Two trains cannot occupy one block at any time so if for some reason this was sensed as a possiblilty by the control system the trains would be stopped. Very similar to today except now I believe that there has to be an empty block between two trains, so a train can be in blocks one and three but not block two for example.

[coasterfreak101]

^I know how blocks work, that's not my question. My question is how there's a train on the first and the second drops, because 1. that's the fastest dispatch I've ever seen in my entire life, and 2. that isn't very much space at all between the trains, and even if the top of the second hill functions as a block the train coming up the third hill still isn't far enough ahead of the one behind it to be safely out of the block before the next one enters it.

 

I mean, are we sure it isn't a few pictures from the Tower or something stitched together? Just judging from the way the edges of the picture are all over the place and there's four out of five trains all on the first half of the ride with none running the rest of the course...

[rcdude]

I believe this was discussed on here a while back, but that photo is several stuck together. While Revolution did indeed run five trains at one point, only three were ever on the course. One train can be between the top of the lift and the hill before the loop, another can be between there and just before the point where it threads the loop, and the third can be located anywhere after that point. In that picture, there are two trains in the same block section and no train is in the station. With five trains, one would be in the station at all times, and the ride used to have a mechanism that would drag the next train in while simultaneously dispatching. I do not know for sure, but I'm guessing the dispatch interval would be approximately 30 seconds when using all of the trains. Now, unless I am mistaken, Revolution only has three remaining trains, and it is rare that all three are run at once (I typically see the ride operating with two). Other than the first couple hours of the day, I have never seen a line longer than 15 minutes for it even on crowded days.

[Tmcdllr]

Can someone explain to me how a) those two trains on the first two drops are probably less than ten seconds apart, and b) they can be that close safely? I get that older Schwarzkopfs ran plenty of trains, but a ten-second dispatch with no safe place to stop the trailing train doesn't seem right.

 

You asked for an explanation of that so let's try this....

 

The lift is one block, from the top of the lift to the top of the next hill is another block, from there to the top of the next hill is another block...etc. The train on the lift and the one going down the first drop are both in two different blocks. As long as the train on the lift does not get to the top of it before the train ahead of it clears the block it is in its fine. Still very close but as long as the dispatch wasn't too early they would be fine.

[Tmcdllr]

I believe this was discussed on here a while back, but that photo is several stuck together. While Revolution did indeed run five trains at one point, only three were ever on the course. One train can be between the top of the lift and the hill before the loop, another can be between there and just before the point where it threads the loop, and the third can be located anywhere after that point. In that picture, there are two trains in the same block section and no train is in the station. With five trains, one would be in the station at all times, and the ride used to have a mechanism that would drag the next train in while simultaneously dispatching. I do not know for sure, but I'm guessing the dispatch interval would be approximately 30 seconds when using all of the trains. Now, unless I am mistaken, Revolution only has three remaining trains, and it is rare that all three are run at once (I typically see the ride operating with two). Other than the first couple hours of the day, I have never seen a line longer than 15 minutes for it even on crowded days.

 

Is that using the blocking setup they use today or back when it first opened? The reason I ask is then why the need for block brakes at the top of every hill? Using the blocking scheme of today some of them could be eliminated but then why are they there in the first place? And I do remember 5 trains running, which you could do with the "original" block scheme, but then again that was some 30 years ago. Who would know this for sure?

[rcdude]

^There are trims on every hill. I do not think most of them are blocks, and if they are then the ride must have not run much faster originally. At the spacing the trains are at in the picture, there would have to have been two on the lift at once and I know that would never happen under standard operation on any coaster. Besides, I don't think there is any possible way a train could be stopped, unloaded, loaded, checked, and dispatched in 10 seconds when it holds 20 riders.

 

Now, I of course didn't ever ride this with the original set-up, but from what I have heard that picture could not occur under operating conditions unless there was a malfunction. The jagged edges suggest several overlapping pictures, and so does the slight warping at a couple points. My guess is that the train at the bottom of the lift and the one at the bottom of the second drop were caught in the same picture (as was the one entering the station), and the one at the base of the first drop was in another picture. The final piece of evidence...there are actually six trains visible in the picture (base of lift, base of first drop, base of second drop, top of hill entering loop, entering final helix, and entering station), and I am 95% sure the ride only had five.

[Tmcdllr]

Well there you go, 6 trains proves the picture was pieced together.

[coasterfreak101]

I believe this was discussed on here a while back, but that photo is several stuck together. While Revolution did indeed run five trains at one point, only three were ever on the course. One train can be between the top of the lift and the hill before the loop, another can be between there and just before the point where it threads the loop, and the third can be located anywhere after that point. In that picture, there are two trains in the same block section and no train is in the station. With five trains, one would be in the station at all times, and the ride used to have a mechanism that would drag the next train in while simultaneously dispatching. I do not know for sure, but I'm guessing the dispatch interval would be approximately 30 seconds when using all of the trains. Now, unless I am mistaken, Revolution only has three remaining trains, and it is rare that all three are run at once (I typically see the ride operating with two). Other than the first couple hours of the day, I have never seen a line longer than 15 minutes for it even on crowded days.

 

This is exactly what I was thinking as a logical block setup. Thank you! That picture would have put two trains on the lift at once, and not enough room between trains when the loop block came. Glad I'm not crazy!

[XYZ]

The picture is multiple pictured threaded or stitched together, 100% sure of it. I posted it because one picture alone cannot have the whole layout of the Revolution in this much detail.

[Wes]

Also you can tell it's stitched together by having eyes when you look at it.

[Manic Monte]

I love all this talk about Revolution. This ride doesn't get enough love from modern coaster fans, and certainly not the park. It should be a national treasure and more than any other ride in the park (Colossus included), deserves a complete makeover from Six Flags. Paint job, new trains, station and trims removed/disabled.

Edited February 4, 2012 by Manic Monte

[Sir Clinksalot]

Forgive me if I'm wrong (because I probably am), but pre-OTSR's I don't think there were as many trims on Revolution as they are now. Or at least, if there were, they were never really on. I thought I had read somewhere that they had to add trims since the new trains are so much heavier.

[QueerRudie]

Rudie, I too have a fondness and great memories of Revolution and would be thrilled if it was ever brought back to its former glory, new trains, no trims, etc. I must say I admire and appreciate your knowledge and love for this ride as I completely feel the same way about it. It is a true engineering marvel designed by the greatest coaster innovator in history, is built to last, and truly in its day was incredible. Hopefully it will get at least some of that back. Whenever I visit the park I always make sure I ride Revolution two times or more. I remember riding it as a kid before the OTSRs and heavy trimming and it was a blast so when I ride it now, as im getting beaten silly I remember those great rides from the past.

 

And yes, they did run ALL 5 TRAINS, it was awesome! The best part was "threading the needle", one train cresting the loop the same time another train was running through it.

 

Thanks! I'd like to say that I'm an expert on Schwarzkopf's coasters- but that wouldn't be accurate: I happen to have followed His rides since my very first one back in (CLASSIFIED) at Busch Gardens: The Old Country... which just dated me quite a bit.

 

With the renovation of the other Loopingracer coaster (sooperdooperLooper) and the new trains, I suspect SFMM will be pushed towards this sooner rather than later: The magnetic brakes are rapidly becoming standard on coasters, and the current Revolution trains are aging a bit- thus making replacement almost urgent. Now that people realize that the OTSRs were a huge mistake, perhaps we'll see the advent of seatbelts in the future on new vehicles.

 

Re: Composite photo of Revolution from 1977: Schwarzkopf blocked the ride for up to six train operations, Revolution was delivered with five trains, and operated all five during it's initial few years. With one on the lift, one in the platform, one in the first 1/4 course, one in the Loop block, and one on the brakes, it could get dicey if you slowed down for even 1/10th of a second... I can imagine the ops back then having to hustle constantly to keep things from stacking up.

 

Re: Trims: Schwarzkopf coasters were -never- delivered with trims. Not once. It is a misnomer to think of the blocks as trims, as they are not. All trimming of speed is an aftermarket feature that parks would build into a ride- SFMM was no exception. Most American parks adjusted the blocking stations on their Schwarzkopf coasters to trim speed as per their own needs. While some parks used the blocks as trim stations, some (SFMM!) were a bit heavy- handed when it came to it. With Revolution, additional trims were added throughout the cousrse, which if removed would deliver a world-class thrill again.

 

R.D.

Praise be to Anton

[Tmcdllr]

^I knew those were block brakes as they do not even look or function like trims (the brakes in the CENTER ON THE TRACK at the top of each hill- which look like they originally came with the ride). The only trim brakes that I am aware of and that look like they were added after the fact (like you have just explained) are the brakes on the SIDES of the track at the top of the run to the loop and the same type of brakes just before you go through the middle of the loop. There are no other trims on this ride unless you count the brakes at the end of the ride entering the transfer track. All of the other brakes during the course are for blocking/emergency use plus, these brakes just happen to be in a spot where the train creeps through them so it would not make sense to trim the train there, there is no need to.

[bostonlva]

FrightFest1408 posted this on the SFMM Facebook page.

 

 

Two things I get from it. They are deconstructing log jammer pretty fast and the old metro stations looks like its gone

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHlZYCwdUVY

 

 

@FrightFest1408 how much of the log jammer was left?

Edited February 5, 2012 by bostonlva

[FrightFest1408]

Haha its my update! Paintball,Arcade and the other shop is blocked off due to clearing to lex luthor.

[dylanreich]

^How are you adding the 3D to the video? Youtube says it's converted 3D. Nice update BTW.

[Tmcdllr]

New staff cafeteria......YES!!!!

[FrightFest1408]

^that is just rumored.

^^ Go to edit info and click 3D...thanks

[galindoverhere]

Screamscape's latest update confirms:

SFMM fans... Sunday, Feb 5th is your LAST CHANCE to ride Superman: Escape From Krypton until Lex Luthor: Drop of Doom is ready to open.

Get your last rides before it's too late guys! LL: DOD better go up fast!

[6flagsbrad]

That video just made me ten times more excited for West Coast Bash! I can't wait to see what Log Jammer's site looks like now.

[Nyteowl]

Just got back from a great day at the park. Went with a friend for my birthday . Tatsu,X2,and Green Lantern were all around 45 minute waits all day which wasn't too bad. Everything else with the exception of S:EFK was 10 minutes or less. Oh, and Riddler's is still on one train which sucked . That was about a 45 minute wait as well. Hopefully it'll be back up to 2 trains in time for WCB. See everyone there!

[6flagsbrad]

^ Man, I thought they had two trains on Riddler again. That's the only coaster I haven't done in a few years, I'll have to hit that one first at WCB.

[DJeXeL]

Went to the park today and crowds were light. Longest wait of the day was GL @ 30 minutes.

 

X2 had a 30 minute wait in the morning due to late block check and sitting in the queue for 15 minutes while they completed it. X2 was down to a 15 minute wait around 430. The crew was doing an amazing job dispatching the trains. A train was dispatched to the lift while the other was coming into the transfer. There were doing this consistently.

Riddler's still only has 1 train along with Ninja. Viper opened with 2 trains but removed one around 12. Tastu had its usual 2 train, 1 station operation but the line was still only 20-25 minutes. Apocalypse had 2 trains and was pretty much walk on the entire day. Walked right through the all pre-shows every time I rode.

Deja Vu's former queue is still untouched along with its entrance sign. I'm sure they will be removed in a few weeks or so. Sorry no pics as I would've had to take them from the top of Apocalypse's lift which would be violating a park policy.

 

Walked by S:EFK and the line was well out of the entrance so I passed since only "A" side was running until about 4.

 

Shot a couple quick photos of Log Jammer's site while passing by.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And the former Metro station....

 

 

Colossus is running like a dream. Got 6 ( 4 front, 2 back) very nice rides in today filled with some very nice floater airtime. Best rides I've had on Colossus in about 5 years or so.

 

Entire section in red is getting extensive track work done and getting all wood replaced. Nice to see this gem getting some TLC.

Edited February 5, 2012 by DJeXeL

[cal1br3tto]

Colossus is running like a dream. Got 6 ( 4 front, 2 back) very nice rides in today filled with some very nice floater airtime. Best rides I've had on Colossus in about 5 years or so.

I knew it still had potential! I'd like to get some rides of that caliber in before they transform it into something even better (if indeed they are going to).