Coasterguy21
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Posts posted by Coasterguy21
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^^Must have found that somewhere else. I have been following this since the very beginning and that was definitely NOT one of his tweets.
I'm going to keep my predictions fairly realistic (they get more out of hand as they get down . But like the weather forecast, anything past Day Three is a Crap Shoot). It'll be a great next few years at the park as the 150th Anniversary Season is worked towards.
My official prediction(s) for 2015:
-Major Flat Ride Addition (Don't know what, but something of that sort)
OR
-Dark Ride Themed to the Old West (though, unless they really upped this, I feel this would be more of a family ride than a thrill ride. See WMG)
OR
-GCI Wooden Coaster (fairly cheap and can be built in a smaller time frame)
OR
-Another S&S 4D Free Spin with higher capacity (can also be built in a smaller time frame)
We already know that they are pumping lots of money into the Hotel Breakers renovation (which is extremely exciting). Last year's additions and changes were also great. I'm sure we'll see much more in the way of park improvements as well. We may also, as long as the behind the scenes work went well, see a coaster renamed King James. Whether it be temporarily or permanently, we'll soon see.
I'm excited no matter what is announced next season. Anything for a park is exciting to me because they always seem to be good moves, no matter what the general consensus is otherwise.
Whatever it is...High Noon to me screams out Frontier Trail/Frontiertown.
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Now why would it start so early? People aren't thinking about Halloween that early! C'mon Busch!
You do realize they aren't the only ones right? Halloween events, as pointed out, are very successful at parks, especially BGW. HalloWeekends begins at Cedar Point on September 12th as well.
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^Many thought that this would, indeed, be the 4D Free Spin. So I don't know what "clueless" things you are stating. When the Batman: The Ride name was leaked, that kind of caught everyone off guard I think. But overall, it fits and will be fine.
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^Don't really think they'll care.
Truth be told, I enjoy that they are refurbishing Carousel Plaza and doing some work/celebrating their 40th Anniversary. Two big coasters in three years is good for any park. Now is time for them to kind of lay back and continue riding the Goliath train (seriously, wait was up to three hours when I was there last Wednesday and never dipped below 2).
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RMC only has 2 projects for 2015, as stated on their website. So rule out Iron Mean Streak. Or Steel streak.
Three. Don't forget Wildfire.
Wildfire will open in 2016. So it's technically a 2016 project.
At any rate, something tells me this won't be a coaster at all. The only clues we "may" have are
-High Noon (indicating old west)
-Camp Rou (indicating Rougarou which has nothing to do with the Old West)
The only clue we REALLY have is Jason McClure releasing to the press back in July that the 2015 addition will be aimed towards Teens and Thrill Seekers. Doesn't mean its a coaster or anything of that sort.
Then there are all of Tony's posts that went right in line with speculation on PointBuzz (Pirate Ride building, Blue Streak Midway, the bayou area, Mantis & Mean Streak). He's been having fun and playing lots of jokes to get people to throw out crazy ideas.
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My guess is something will replace the mine ride and a multi-year refresh of western town. High Noon seems to be a hint to. Maybe a location from the webcam? As in straight ahead?
What?
^Yes, but there is a third camera presently being installed. This is the one that everyone is assuming will be used for construction. It was this third cam that Tony tweeted about in the tweet that I linked.
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I guarantee this will be the Mantis makeover, and hopefully Mean Streak RMC.
I can almost guarantee not. The term "High Noon" was used which makes me immediately think of the old west (someone on another forum said something pirate related but high noon definitely is an old west term, other than meaning just "noon"). This would be Frontier Trail or Frontiertown. According to the Frontier Trail brochure for 2014 (http://i.pointbuzz.com/frontiertrail/frontier-trail-2-3.jpg), Mantis is not a part of the trail.
Then there was this tweet by Tony Clark about getting the third live cam going (one that many have speculated will be the cam that covers the new construction): https://twitter.com/TonyClarkCP/status/505012668475121665/photo/1
The cam, at that point, is facing over towards Frontiertown, with Mean Streak not even being in view.
Of course, the cams can be adjusted at any time without anyone getting up to them. But that may be a sign of what area the new attraction will be coming. Couple that with "high noon". Right now, it's still anyone's guess, not many clues to deal with.
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How many times have you gotten off of a ride and wished you could ride it again? Or got right back in line? No need to do that now. You get to experience it twice (second time being slightly different actually after watching the video again) without having to wait again.
And this is actually not even close to be accurate either. The two sides are different...VERY different. It will be like riding Smiler where you have an entire experience that's broken up by a lift hill. While I agree with those saying that I'd rather have a 4,500 foot ride that happens all at once, that concept for Colossus doesn't exist and what we currently have is WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY better than the old Colossus, which hasn't been a good ride since 1985.
I'm not a huge fan of having a lift hill in the middle of a coaster, but that doesn't mean I not/wasn't a fan of rides like Big Bad Wolf, The Beast, Smiler, Takabisha, Big Thunder Mountain, etc....
Nevermind, just watched the video again and I can spot the differences better when actually watching for them. First inversion, blue train just does a roll. Second one, the green train (the Top Gun Stall) actually hangs inverted before completing the inversion. There are also different elements taken to get to those inversions.
Either way, I'm excited about this ride no matter what.
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People are absolutely allowed to be excited, again, I'm just stating my opinion. But I don't really understand the reasoning going on here. Wouldn't you prefer one continuous ride, that was approximately 4000 feet long, that did all that incredible dueling stuff, but didn't have a lift hill in the middle and wasn't essentially the same ride twice? That's what the ride could have been if they'd kept it as two separate tracks and used all of the existing structure. I know that's sure as heck what I'd prefer, but for some reason everybody is acting like what they're actually getting is preferable.
How many times have you gotten off of a ride and wished you could ride it again? Or got right back in line? No need to do that now. You get to experience it twice (second time being slightly different actually after watching the video again) without having to wait again.
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Bryan Edwards also just posted this:
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I'm pleased with this addition. The S&S version seems like a big improvement on the Intamin version. I think this is a great addition for the park and I really hope to make it down there to experience it in the next few years.
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^Yeah that's what I got from "Top Gun Stall". Where one train twists over the other inverted. How many people will be "giving the bird"?
"You know, the finger?"
Super excited for this addition. I've got to make it to the west coast next year!
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They dumped $20 million for Patroit.
They dumped $14 million on Patriot. $8 million on Prowler in 2009.
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Mantis & Mean Streak still pull in good waits. More than just "a one train wait". Not everyone is an enthusiast and, believe it or not, I do know of people who repeat rides on Mantis & Mean Streak. I personally don't because I want to get my other rides in first before re-riding a ride, but I honestly do not mind either coaster.
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Back on topic.
I remember in years past watching the video announcements. I believe it's more 10am EST when the announce. Has it been confirmed a time?
The last few years it has been very very early in the morning. I remember getting up at 6 last year for work and watching the announcement video with my morning coffee.
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Parks don't have to do exactly what we want or would like to see, but they do have make improvements and continually evolve. They're a business, and the tourism industry is particularly fickle. Older rides that no longer get a lot of attention from guests, specifically positive attention, are just dead weight to a park that must continually change to meet attendance and revenue goals.
Cedar Fair also understands return on investment. Making a smaller change could see a fairly equivalent return as making a much more expensive installation, only in less time. While the rumors going around don't have a ton of weight behind them, they seem fairly cost-effective and would certainly increase the appeal of older rides.
As a personal note, I do not find Mantis or Mean Streak appealing as they are now. They both physically hurt me. Mantis, at least, has a seemingly decent layout. I find Mean Streak's general design is out-dated; it has not aged well. The layout is peculiar and ineffective, IMHO. Any change to either coaster would make me want to ride them again.
I don't predict a substantial change to Mean Streak next year. Any significant change to Mean Streak, and CP would likely give the public some warning so they could get their last rides in.
Yes, I know how the business works and agree with you on the above. But what I'm getting at here is that I don't think the ridership on those rides has suffered to the point of removal or change. The Mantis to Floorless conversion wouldn't be that cost-effective (Sitdown maybe, but I don't think the layout would be fun for a sitdown without reprofiling), RMCing I guess I could see being there. But on your personal note, does John Q public feel that way? Last time I was at Cedar Point, Mantis was at a two hour wait. I'll admit that even I was surprised, but I don't think ridership is super suffering on those rides.
The Gemini Midway improvements this year have proved to give a great ROI to the park. Tony stated in an interview that they do plan at looking around the park at what areas need to be refreshed or improved. I would not be surprised if the Blue Streak Midway was next. With the haunted house located at the Point Pavilion now axed for HalloWeekends, maybe that front area of the park is next.
My bet is that nothing will happen to Mean Streak or Mantis this year outside of one of them probably getting the "King James" name for a bit.
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First post on their page presently....https://www.facebook.com/WorldsofFun/posts/10152413412363250
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^Thanks for jumping in. Let me clarify that a bit. I was speaking about the city itself. The metro area (throwing in Norton Shores and surrounding areas) has 170,000. When you finally add in Grand Rapids (which was the semi larger market I was talking about), then you can reach 1.3 million. But Grand Rapids is also almost an hour away.
Of course, its not just the immediate market of 1.3 million that is included, but the Lansing and Kalamazoo markets are as well. Directly from Cedar Fair's website:
The combination amusement and water park located near Muskegon, Michigan serves a total market area of approximately 5 million people, principally from central and western Michigan and eastern Indiana.This is compared to Cedar Point at 23 million. The next highest on the list compared to MiA is World's of Fun at 7 million. WoF doesn't have the profit margin that MiA has (though I know it has a good one). WoF pulls in roughly 1 million for a 7 million person market. So MiA is doing good to pull in 750,000-800,000 a year in a 5 million person market right? Surprisingly, Dorney has the biggest market in the chain.
I miss Falling Star too. They did leave the power to that area though. Maybe something will be put in there...eventually.
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We don't even know the for sure layout yet. Twisting drop or regular drop, doesn't matter to me. I'll still ride it and if it is anything like RMC's other creations, then it'll be a kick butt ride!
After YOLO last time with YOLOcoaster, I wonder if SFMM will go with COLT (Colossus Only Lives Twice)...yeah, that was lame.
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^Muskegon is a city of 37,000 people. The next closest decent sides markets are an almost an hour and 1.5 hours away. It is well over 2.5 hours to both the Detroit & Chicago markets. When your "competitors" are over 3 hours away, why the heck do you need to build something up if you're already performing extremely well? Why take the risk? The park is "expanding" on its own timetables based on its success for the market. Not because people are stating its dying and demand more goes into it. Anyone listening to conference calls or FunForward presentations over the past few years could see how successful the park really is. Even in the first FunForward presentation in 2012, Ouimet mentioned that the market was small and the park was already performing in the upper level of it. So how do we know? The CEO does, and he told us. Pulling in 800,000 people for a park this size and in the middle of nowhere during a 3.5 month operating season? Call me crazy, but those are pretty good numbers.
The state relies on tourism and the lake is the biggest draw in the area. As with most of Cedar Fair parks, 90% of visitors are return visitors, pointing out that a majority of locals attend the park. Those from out of state that attend the park make it a stop as part of a bigger trip to the beach and places in Northern or West Michigan.
And how do we arrive at that $15-$20-$25 million price tag. Just based off of what Thunderhawk cost ($10 million). So people saying it "needs" (does a park really ever "need" anything, or do people just "wish" it has something) a bigger coaster, it would probably be more than $12 million, with $15 million being a good median number.
As for not having a haunt (not directed at you, just remember someone stating about how there isn't a haunt here). The weather turns very sour in that area of the state, specifically near the lakeshore, in October. More so than it would in Sandusky or even Shakopee. By Mid-October, you're already facing temps in the Mid-30s and howling winds in the evening and many rides wouldn't even be operating. Wouldn't be worth it. Hence the reason the park isn't open past Mid September. There is an attraction called "The Haunt" which is open in Walker, Michigan about 40 minutes away that is open in October and it is usually freezing. However, most of the attractions are indoors there and that's how that can be pulled off. It's also a bit further inland and isn't as affected by the lake.
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^Does a park really ever "have to" or "need to" do anything though? It's all just enthusiasts "wish lists". The park knows how things are operating and maybe the ridership numbers both pull in are justifiable to NOT do renovations on them. Nothing was ever stated that "it will happen".
Disaster Transport broke down a lot and the building was an eyesore on the beach. It also sat in the exact area they wanted to build a new coaster in. That's why it went. Same with Space Spiral. Not as much of an eyesore and definitely iconic, but it was a maintenance nightmare and its ridership just wasn't justifiable.
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They're just playing some games. I doubt either of them are going anywhere. It's at that point that you really got to wonder what is going in. We know it'll be a thrill ride judging by what McClure said to the papers. It was stated that the off-season tour will not want to be missed this year. Just so many options.
I bet they showed the two coasters just for giggles. If not, one of them may be the next King James. To be honest, I highly doubt that either of them will be changed. The floorless Mantis has been a pipe dream for years and everyone always swears its going to happen the next season. Same with the RMC Makeover on Mean Streak.
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Whizzer at Six Flags Great America. Two back to back rides including being on the final train of the night. Love riding that coaster at closing.
Cedar Point (CP) Discussion Thread
in Theme Parks, Roller Coasters, & Donkeys!
Posted
^I do like the position of the webcams today. Looking straight down on Power Tower so you can see the ride operating=AWESOME!
Then of course the Millennium Force, Mantis, Iron Dragon, Frontiertown view. Digging it!
I still think that third webcam location may be for construction. That's off of Gemini looking back towards the woods/Millennium Island/Frontiertown. But who knows, it could just be a "third webcam" too